Player Wants Trade b/c of playing time despite starting 95% of games?

Enzo · 01-30-2023, 06:52 PM

Playing with the Mariners in 1981 and Sixto Lezcano has requested a trade because he is a role player? Despite him stating 106/110 games.

https://imgur.com/a/YPsT2r7

Bobbyraz49 · 01-30-2023, 09:13 PM

That's ridiculous. Does he think he's Cal Ripken Jr. ?

Pelican · 01-31-2023, 04:39 PM

Well, I would grant his wish to be traded. It’s one thing to have a malcontent in the clubhouse. It’s quite another to have a psycho who is not operating in the real world.

Bobfather · 02-01-2023, 02:05 AM

Curious, is he set to start in your default lineups? If not that may be the problem.

Rain King · 02-01-2023, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobfather

Curious, is he set to start in your default lineups? If not that may be the problem.

Yeah, that was my thought. Maybe he is the strong side of a platoon or something?

JerseyPirate · 02-01-2023, 09:37 AM

That's right up there with someone who expects to be "middle of the order" and I bat him 5th, the exact middle of the order, and he complains.

Leo_The_Lip · 02-01-2023, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerseyPirate

That's right up there with someone who expects to be "middle of the order" and I bat him 5th, the exact middle of the order, and he complains.

It is well known by veteran OOTP players that -- for game purposes -- "middle of the order" means batting third or fourth. It has nothing to do with geometric means or averages.

This is the way the game is coded. Live with it.

PSUColonel · 02-01-2023, 01:28 PM

I hate to say it, but this is just another case of this type of thing not working well in OOTP. As it has been said here, the Front Office part of OOTP needs a lot of attention. I would consider this one of those areas. If a player is getting 95 percent of the playing time, there is really no way he should be complaining and/or demanding a trade.

I know people around here like to shuffle this kind of stuff under the rug, or defuse it with humor by "pretending" the player has a legitimate claim...but the fact is that this is just another area of the game that isn't working nearly as well as it should.

Worst yet, none of us here even know anymore if things like this are even on "the to do list" or if they are just unintended consequences we will have to live with because there isn't enough time or resources to work on it.

tejdog1 · 02-02-2023, 01:36 PM

This is something that needs work.
If you're giving a guy 400 PAs off the bench he should be happy.

Charley575 · 02-02-2023, 08:36 PM

This is right up there with first-year pros who are "angry" about their "role on team" even though they are playing every day in the minors.

Syd Thrift · 02-03-2023, 02:03 AM

I feel like I don’t ever see a guy just out and out say “I don’t like the lack of winning” or “I don’t get along with <player>”. When things come to a head it’s always because of starts and roles IME. One thing I’d love to see going forward is more of those kinds of things, perhaps even a “he goes or I go” type ultimatum.

mytreds · 02-03-2023, 12:46 PM

Player personalities and player reactions are something that should’ve been updated long ago in the franchise.

Enzo · 02-08-2023, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobfather

Curious, is he set to start in your default lineups? If not that may be the problem.

I don't set default lineups, I put them together on gameday.

Syd Thrift · 02-08-2023, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enzo

I don't set default lineups, I put them together on gameday.

Yeah, I think the AI looks at the actual default lineups and gets "angrier" every day that a guy who wants to be in them isn't, even if you manually put him into the game daily. I'd just set-and-forget those and then continue to go about your business, personally (thought it might not be in time to save your relationship with the guy mentioned in the OP).

uruguru · 02-08-2023, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mytreds

Player personalities and player reactions are something that should’ve been updated long ago in the franchise.

I honestly just turn them off so there's one less AI shortcoming to run across.

This is still nothing like the time a team exposed their ace pitcher to the expansion draft in the same offseason when he literally wins the Cy Young award, or (just yesterday) a team placing a starting pitcher on waivers just two weeks before he's named to the All-Star team (and no one claimed him, lol).

I turn off as many features as possible where the AI has to make a decision!

PSUColonel · 02-08-2023, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uruguru

I honestly just turn them off so there's one less AI shortcoming to run across.

This is still nothing like the time a team exposed their ace pitcher to the expansion draft in the same offseason when he literally wins the Cy Young award, or (just yesterday) a team placing a starting pitcher on waivers just two weeks before he's named to the All-Star team (and no one claimed him, lol).

I turn off as many features as possible where the AI has to make a decision!

This is hardly a ringing endorsement

uruguru · 02-08-2023, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

This is hardly a ringing endorsement

Very fun game, two ways to play.

You can strip everything down and try to give the AI a fighting chance. This is a neverending challenge because there are always more AI failures popping up that need to be dealt with.

Or you can turn on every feature imaginable to obfuscate the game so that the challenge becomes building such an overwhelmingly talented team so that you can reliably overcome the various structural RNGs you've thrown in your own path. This might take a few seasons longer and I think it's what most people do.

Bobfather · 02-09-2023, 01:08 AM

I think we put a lot of our biases onto the AI. Then we think the AI should be perfect and even smarter than us. The way I look at it this is just my opinion, Every team run by the AI has an Owner, a GM, A manager, Scouts, coaches, etc. Some of those are really good, some aren't, some may be dysfunctional, while others work really well together. I also believe for the most part the AI is biased toward ratings, not stats. So how does an all-star pitcher get released, the owner said to cut payroll. If you use personality maybe he was a jerk. Or maybe he just pitched better than his ratings. Bad trades, a bad GM, and a good GM I think AI teams more closely resemble IRL than we realize. Just follow the front office management of The Boston Red Sox since 2003.

PSUColonel · 02-09-2023, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobfather

I think we put a lot of our biases onto the AI. Then we think the AI should be perfect and even smarter than us. The way I look at it this is just my opinion, Every team run by the AI has an Owner, a GM, A manager, Scouts, coaches, etc. Some of those are really good, some aren't, some may be dysfunctional, while others work really well together. I also believe for the most part the AI is biased toward ratings, not stats. So how does an all-star pitcher get released, the owner said to cut payroll. If you use personality maybe he was a jerk. Or maybe he just pitched better than his ratings. Bad trades, a bad GM, and a good GM I think AI teams more closely resemble IRL than we realize. Just follow the front office management of The Boston Red Sox since 2003.

One way to help the AI (and I have argued this point endlessly) is to stay with default AI evaluation settings. (65/20/10/5) You also will need trading on the most difficult level, and keep trading preferences at neutral.

OOTP Rookie · 02-09-2023, 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

One way to help the AI (and I have argued this point endlessly) is to stay with default AI evaluation settings. (65/20/10/5) You also will need trading on the most difficult level, and keep trading preferences at neutral.

I use a few house rules to compensate for the inherent weaknesses of the AI.

Waiver Wire: I never put in a claim. If I see a player on waivers that I'd like to have, I have to trade for him. Unfortunately, often when I click on "Make this work now", it turns out that "You have no player who makes this deal work". Yeah, okay. But the player is on waivers!?!?!

Free Agents: If I see that a team released a decent (to often very good) young player, I will manually place him back into that organization. I won't sign one of these players who realistically should never have been let go.

Roster Management: Once the offseason starts, I go through the AI teams and release scrubs and over-the-hill veterans that are taking up valuable 40-man roster spots or who are clogging up AAA and AA.

Rule 5 Draft: If I see a talented young player exposed, I'll look at his teams 40-man roster to see why he isn't protected. For some reason, the AI seems to almost always have the 40-man roster at full capacity going into the offseason. But there will usually be a large number of scrubs and over-the-hill veterans clogging up the 40. If I see something like that, I make the necessary changes so that the team won't unnecessarily lose a prospect.

I do these things to give the AI a fighting chance and to keep the game somewhat challenging.

I'm curious to see how the developers will address some of these issues in the upcoming release.

01-30-2023, 06:52 PM	#1
Enzo Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2020 Location: Williamsport, PA Posts: 17	Player Wants Trade b/c of playing time despite starting 95% of games? Playing with the Mariners in 1981 and Sixto Lezcano has requested a trade because he is a role player? Despite him stating 106/110 games. https://imgur.com/a/YPsT2r7 __________________ Go Thunder!

01-31-2023, 04:39 PM	#3
Pelican Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2021 Location: Wilmington, Delaware Posts: 2,948	Well, I would grant his wish to be traded. It’s one thing to have a malcontent in the clubhouse. It’s quite another to have a psycho who is not operating in the real world. __________________ Pelican OOTP 2020-? ”Hard to believe, Harry.”

02-01-2023, 02:05 AM	#4
Bobfather All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Boston Ma. Posts: 1,637	Curious, is he set to start in your default lineups? If not that may be the problem. __________________ I play out every game—one pitch mode.

02-02-2023, 01:36 PM	#9
tejdog1 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Danbury, CT Posts: 1,647	This is something that needs work. If you're giving a guy 400 PAs off the bench he should be happy. __________________ It's amazing How you make your face just like a wall How you take your heart and turn it off How I turn my head and lose it all And it's unnerving How just one move puts me by myself There you go just trusting someone else Now I know I put us both through hell ~Matchbox 20, "Leave" Everyone knows it's spelled "TRAID", not trade

02-02-2023, 08:36 PM	#10
Charley575 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 544	This is right up there with first-year pros who are "angry" about their "role on team" even though they are playing every day in the minors. __________________

01-30-2023, 09:13 PM	#2
Bobbyraz49 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 926	That's ridiculous. Does he think he's Cal Ripken Jr. ?

02-01-2023, 09:37 AM	#6
JerseyPirate Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 172	That's right up there with someone who expects to be "middle of the order" and I bat him 5th, the exact middle of the order, and he complains.

02-01-2023, 01:28 PM	#8
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,105	I hate to say it, but this is just another case of this type of thing not working well in OOTP. As it has been said here, the Front Office part of OOTP needs a lot of attention. I would consider this one of those areas. If a player is getting 95 percent of the playing time, there is really no way he should be complaining and/or demanding a trade. I know people around here like to shuffle this kind of stuff under the rug, or defuse it with humor by "pretending" the player has a legitimate claim...but the fact is that this is just another area of the game that isn't working nearly as well as it should. Worst yet, none of us here even know anymore if things like this are even on "the to do list" or if they are just unintended consequences we will have to live with because there isn't enough time or resources to work on it.

02-03-2023, 12:46 PM	#12
mytreds All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2019 Posts: 1,182	Player personalities and player reactions are something that should’ve been updated long ago in the franchise. __________________ “Baseball isn’t statistics; it’s Joe DiMaggio rounding second.” “Once, centuries ago, it was the beloved national pastime of the Americas, Wesley. Abandoned by a society that prized fast food and faster games. Lost to impatience.” “ The term ‘WAR’ should be replaced by ‘WAG’. WAR isn’t an actual measurement; it’s just a wild-ass guess” -Bill James RIP National League 1876-2022 Floreat semper vel invita morte. I make custom ballparks.

02-09-2023, 01:08 AM	#18
Bobfather All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Boston Ma. Posts: 1,637	I think we put a lot of our biases onto the AI. Then we think the AI should be perfect and even smarter than us. The way I look at it this is just my opinion, Every team run by the AI has an Owner, a GM, A manager, Scouts, coaches, etc. Some of those are really good, some aren't, some may be dysfunctional, while others work really well together. I also believe for the most part the AI is biased toward ratings, not stats. So how does an all-star pitcher get released, the owner said to cut payroll. If you use personality maybe he was a jerk. Or maybe he just pitched better than his ratings. Bad trades, a bad GM, and a good GM I think AI teams more closely resemble IRL than we realize. Just follow the front office management of The Boston Red Sox since 2003. __________________ I play out every game—one pitch mode.