Something weird going on with my financial system

dev6015 · 02-15-2023, 04:50 PM

I'm a few decades into a sim and I've realized something wonky is happening where some of the best free agents aren't signing. Most did sign in the offseason, but take note of the ratings and game date (in the middle of the season) for these guys that were FA's at the end of last season. One guy (Brady) even opted out of the last 4/$143MM of his contract for...this.

I think it might have something to do with the second screengrab that shows that most teams do not have much (or any) budget space. But I'm not sure how to fix that other than just waiting for those teams to get out from under their bad contracts in a few years. And hoping that they get smarter in the meantime and don't just do the same thing that got them into this mess.

Potentially important context: I just updated this sim from OOTP20 into OOTP23 about two years ago in the game timeline in mid-2040. Perhaps this is just first season weirdness? Has anyone else dealt with something similar?

Syd Thrift · 02-15-2023, 08:28 PM

Yeah if there’s not enough money floating around, players will sit out for a while and usually wind up signing for less. The AI isn’t really equipped to look at a market situation and say “hey, I am unlikely to be paid what I’m making right now based on team budgets so I’ll stand pat”. I think that generally speaking it’s very hard to make AI predictive like that and it’s not necessarily how humans think anyway most of the time so it’s not so bad I guess.

I think the real issue is that your league doesn’t have the money to sign everyone. I usually play in older era leagues and the lack of free agency often IME creates situations like these (because you can’t really just let a decent vet walk and instead keep paying for guys like that in perpetuity) but I’m sure that any number of things could make that happen in any fictional league over time. The quick answer I guess would be to inject some cash into the league. You could edit down the salaries players think they are “worth” in the settings but of course that won’t touch any current deal.

tm1681 · 02-15-2023, 11:10 PM

I've found the same problem.

I run old-timey leagues where there isn't a ton of cash floating around. My leagues have Free Agency, so initially there ended up being quite a few quality players going unsigned each winter because of the combination of lack of funds and player demands. What would eventually happen was that these leftover quality free agents would end up going unsigned until right around opening day of the next season.

The way that I had to fix it was to turn off the automatic importation of yearly financial figures from the in-game database, set my own inflation parameters, and let teams have much greater cash reserves. Basically the AI players aren't good at lowering their salary demands until it's too late, and AI front offices aren't that good at spending money ahead of time based on their revenue prognostications.

Seeing that your game is in 2042, you might be able to fidget with things like ticket prices and maximum cash amounts to see if that helps the teams in your league have more money to spend on free agents since you're at a point where the yearly financials no longer change via the in-game database. However, I can't remember if you can do that if you're not in Commissioner Mode.

dev6015 · 02-16-2023, 02:22 PM

Thanks for your replies here. Yes it seems like the problem is not enough money in the financial system. Although its weird because a few free agents signed very large ($25MM+ per year) contracts last offseason, but those shown above didn't for whatever reason.

I think for the time being I'll keep on simming and hope that teams either get out from under bad contracts and/or any bugs from pulling forward my sim into OOTP23 from OOTP20 work themselves out. Just hate that this feels so unrealistic and throws off the mythology of my league, as a few of these guys were on HOF tracks.

jg2977 · 02-16-2023, 04:07 PM

I've had this happen too. Raising the salary cap fixed it for me.

PSUColonel · 02-17-2023, 08:45 PM

And the OOTP financial system (if you want to call it that) strikes again!

I seriously don't know why there doesn't seem to be any will to change this part of OOTP.

uruguru · 02-19-2023, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

And the OOTP financial system (if you want to call it that) strikes again!

I seriously don't know why there doesn't seem to be any will to change this part of OOTP.

Difficulty

dev6015 · 02-23-2023, 01:16 PM

Posting this for posterity, comments from the forum, and any future beings that run into the same problem and try to Google solutions (like I have been).

As you can see in screengrab #1, which is my current sim in OOTP23, the average profit is super low. In looking back at the original file I imported from OOTP20 into OOTP23, somehow the financials were changed, specifically around the player salary baselines (see screengrab #2). How this happened, I have no idea.

To fix this, I am going to override the player salary baselines back to OOTP20 levels...and I guess wait for some of the bad contracts to wash themselves out over the next few years? If I really wanted to I could recalculate salaries for all players, but that feels like a big modification that might have unintended consequences for my current sim.

Thoughts are welcome - thanks all!

JerseyPirate · 02-23-2023, 03:02 PM

I'm really enjoying OOTP 23 but this one is my biggest annoyance with this version. I play GM/Manager and quick play every game and I'm in 2100 now and the financials are all screwed up. Only a few teams every year have budget money to trade/sign FA's and it makes for a boring game. For me to trade any current 40-man player, I always have to pay 100% salary for any non 40-man player or the teams have no budget to trade. I just looked at my league financial picture and I've had 2-3% inflation set from day 1 and the average team loss is almost $300 mil on roughly $2 bil budget. That's awful and completely unrealistic. I just bumped up the average attendance to 35k and bumped the ticket price from $215 to $300 and that still didn't get MLB in the green but more teams should have money to spend.

I've also had elite players sit out entire seasons and many many others sign 1 year way below market value contracts during spring training just so they can play.

Hopefully this is fixed for v. 24.

BBGiovanni · 02-23-2023, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dev6015

To fix this, I am going to override the player salary baselines back to OOTP20 levels...and I guess wait for some of the bad contracts to wash themselves out over the next few years? If I really wanted to I could recalculate salaries for all players, but that feels like a big modification that might have unintended consequences for my current sim.

Thoughts are welcome - thanks all!

In the future I'll avoid using the salary recalc solution, as it always seems to bring unintended consequences. Which I don't mean as a complaint, I just am never satisfied with which players get what and for how long. I wouldn't feel guilty, if I were you, to edit some of the biggest/dumbest contracts if they really distract you. I did that with some of my promotion/relegation teams when a bunch of marquee free agents (maybe all) signed in the 2nd tier to huge contracts, in part because the contract/budget recalc had put tons of guys on one year league minimum deals. Also I should clarify this is the previous version I'm talking about. But I bet v23 is the same.

dev6015 · 02-23-2023, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerseyPirate

I'm really enjoying OOTP 23 but this one is my biggest annoyance with this version. I play GM/Manager and quick play every game and I'm in 2100 now and the financials are all screwed up. Only a few teams every year have budget money to trade/sign FA's and it makes for a boring game. For me to trade any current 40-man player, I always have to pay 100% salary for any non 40-man player or the teams have no budget to trade. I just looked at my league financial picture and I've had 2-3% inflation set from day 1 and the average team loss is almost $300 mil on roughly $2 bil budget. That's awful and completely unrealistic. I just bumped up the average attendance to 35k and bumped the ticket price from $215 to $300 and that still didn't get MLB in the green but more teams should have money to spend.

I've also had elite players sit out entire seasons and many many others sign 1 year way below market value contracts during spring training just so they can play.

Hopefully this is fixed for v. 24.

Yep, the bolded part of your response here is what made me realize this in the first place. A few players in their prime and on HOF track have been FA's for 1+ full seasons and its completely unrealistic. I think this is something that I'll have to monitor closely going forward to make sure it doesn't get out of whack. But I basically have to depend on the AI to make smart contract decisions from here on out (I guess?) while waiting for some of the ****ty contracts to just unwind themselves.

I haven't ever used inflation but that sounds like a cluster. Not even gonna bother ever doing that. It makes it a bit easier to diagnose when something is wrong when I have a frame of reference for what the financials typically are.

02-15-2023, 11:10 PM	#3
tm1681 All Star Starter Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Salt Lake City, UT Posts: 1,425	I've found the same problem. I run old-timey leagues where there isn't a ton of cash floating around. My leagues have Free Agency, so initially there ended up being quite a few quality players going unsigned each winter because of the combination of lack of funds and player demands. What would eventually happen was that these leftover quality free agents would end up going unsigned until right around opening day of the next season. The way that I had to fix it was to turn off the automatic importation of yearly financial figures from the in-game database, set my own inflation parameters, and let teams have much greater cash reserves. Basically the AI players aren't good at lowering their salary demands until it's too late, and AI front offices aren't that good at spending money ahead of time based on their revenue prognostications. Seeing that your game is in 2042, you might be able to fidget with things like ticket prices and maximum cash amounts to see if that helps the teams in your league have more money to spend on free agents since you're at a point where the yearly financials no longer change via the in-game database. However, I can't remember if you can do that if you're not in Commissioner Mode. Last edited by tm1681; 02-15-2023 at 11:13 PM.

02-23-2023, 01:16 PM	#8
dev6015 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 22	Posting this for posterity, comments from the forum, and any future beings that run into the same problem and try to Google solutions (like I have been). As you can see in screengrab #1, which is my current sim in OOTP23, the average profit is super low. In looking back at the original file I imported from OOTP20 into OOTP23, somehow the financials were changed, specifically around the player salary baselines (see screengrab #2). How this happened, I have no idea. To fix this, I am going to override the player salary baselines back to OOTP20 levels...and I guess wait for some of the bad contracts to wash themselves out over the next few years? If I really wanted to I could recalculate salaries for all players, but that feels like a big modification that might have unintended consequences for my current sim. Thoughts are welcome - thanks all! Attached Images Last edited by dev6015; 02-23-2023 at 01:17 PM.

02-15-2023, 04:50 PM	#1
dev6015 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 22	Something weird going on with my financial system I'm a few decades into a sim and I've realized something wonky is happening where some of the best free agents aren't signing. Most did sign in the offseason, but take note of the ratings and game date (in the middle of the season) for these guys that were FA's at the end of last season. One guy (Brady) even opted out of the last 4/$143MM of his contract for...this. I think it might have something to do with the second screengrab that shows that most teams do not have much (or any) budget space. But I'm not sure how to fix that other than just waiting for those teams to get out from under their bad contracts in a few years. And hoping that they get smarter in the meantime and don't just do the same thing that got them into this mess. Potentially important context: I just updated this sim from OOTP20 into OOTP23 about two years ago in the game timeline in mid-2040. Perhaps this is just first season weirdness? Has anyone else dealt with something similar? Attached Images

02-16-2023, 02:22 PM	#4
dev6015 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 22	Thanks for your replies here. Yes it seems like the problem is not enough money in the financial system. Although its weird because a few free agents signed very large ($25MM+ per year) contracts last offseason, but those shown above didn't for whatever reason. I think for the time being I'll keep on simming and hope that teams either get out from under bad contracts and/or any bugs from pulling forward my sim into OOTP23 from OOTP20 work themselves out. Just hate that this feels so unrealistic and throws off the mythology of my league, as a few of these guys were on HOF tracks.

02-16-2023, 04:07 PM	#5
jg2977 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 24,861	I've had this happen too. Raising the salary cap fixed it for me.

02-17-2023, 08:45 PM	#6
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,105	And the OOTP financial system (if you want to call it that) strikes again! I seriously don't know why there doesn't seem to be any will to change this part of OOTP.

02-23-2023, 03:02 PM	#9
JerseyPirate Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 172	I'm really enjoying OOTP 23 but this one is my biggest annoyance with this version. I play GM/Manager and quick play every game and I'm in 2100 now and the financials are all screwed up. Only a few teams every year have budget money to trade/sign FA's and it makes for a boring game. For me to trade any current 40-man player, I always have to pay 100% salary for any non 40-man player or the teams have no budget to trade. I just looked at my league financial picture and I've had 2-3% inflation set from day 1 and the average team loss is almost $300 mil on roughly $2 bil budget. That's awful and completely unrealistic. I just bumped up the average attendance to 35k and bumped the ticket price from $215 to $300 and that still didn't get MLB in the green but more teams should have money to spend. I've also had elite players sit out entire seasons and many many others sign 1 year way below market value contracts during spring training just so they can play. Hopefully this is fixed for v. 24.