Predetermined outcomes?

[ForeverRoyalKC]

Well I sure didn't mean to cause a ruckus by this thread. I am still relatively new to OOTP. I have '15 and '16, but have still never had the time to seriously sit for a year or so and manage / GM a team with consistency, so I asked this question based on the Show experience. From what I have played of OOTP, I haven't gotten the feeling of predetermination, but again, I haven't gotten to play it straight thru for a long time to feel it's consistent play.

[battists]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoyalKC

Well I sure didn't mean to cause a ruckus by this thread. I am still relatively new to OOTP. I have '15 and '16, but have still never had the time to seriously sit for a year or so and manage / GM a team with consistency, so I asked this question based on the Show experience. From what I have played of OOTP, I haven't gotten the feeling of predetermination, but again, I haven't gotten to play it straight thru for a long time to feel it's consistent play.

Don't worry about them. They're a bit sensitive about this particular topic haha.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoyalKC

Well I sure didn't mean to cause a ruckus by this thread. I am still relatively new to OOTP. I have '15 and '16, but have still never had the time to seriously sit for a year or so and manage / GM a team with consistency, so I asked this question based on the Show experience. From what I have played of OOTP, I haven't gotten the feeling of predetermination, but again, I haven't gotten to play it straight thru for a long time to feel it's consistent play.

You can say what you want. Others sure do, again and again.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Assos

Almost a month, a new record?

I think you're right. Tragically, sadly right, but right nonetheless.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by battists

Don't worry about them. They're a bit sensitive about this particular topic haha.

With good reason!!!

[Toast]

Originally Posted by David Watts

I'll Toast to that

I find it interesting how long you can maintain the position and have no desire what so ever for oxygen! Absolutely amazing!

Thanatoast

[Reggie]

Not only am I sure the game isn't scripted.. in many other games I could almost predict what some individual players would do based on their current batting average or ERA. Can't do that so easy with OOTP.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Toast

I find it interesting how long you can maintain the position and have no desire what so ever for oxygen! Absolutely amazing!

Thanatoast

It's been predetermined that I will maintain the position for life.....Oxygen is over rated.

Sourdough Bread.

[Assos]

This thread is getting crusty again!

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Assos

This thread is getting crusty again!

Yes, someone left the bread out in the rain

Never ending Breadstick

[The Wolf]

"No use to complain
If you're caught out in the rain;
Your mother's quite insane.
Cat food - cat food - cat food - again."

King Crimson

[turdfurgeson]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoyalKC

This is a question that comes from my frustration with The Show games. As popular as The Show is, I know that there have been A LOT of people frustrated also with games seeming to be predetermined. Having big leads and, all of a sudden, their team turns into the Bad News Bears and they lose the game or going into unexplainable losing streaks. Like the AI says "Ok, enough! You had your moment."
Is there any complaints or comments of OOTP being like that?? I havent seen any since I have been on here myself. But thought I would ask because that was one thing that made me want to throw hammers thru windows!

I think I read somewhere, or maybe watching a youtube video for some game play tips that the Show does throw in some things to help steer games to certain results. The example given was that in road to the show mode, sometimes no matter what you do, the result will be pre determined, and it was most noticeable as a pitcher. The examle given was that some batters would foul off every pitch no matter how well it was thrown, trying to either induce a walk or hit. I have never seen that confirmed though.

[rjl518]

ootp can be finicky, but it does not cheat.

[drksd4848]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoyalKC

This is a question that comes from my frustration with The Show games. As popular as The Show is, I know that there have been A LOT of people frustrated also with games seeming to be predetermined. Having big leads and, all of a sudden, their team turns into the Bad News Bears and they lose the game or going into unexplainable losing streaks. Like the AI says "Ok, enough! You had your moment."
Is there any complaints or comments of OOTP being like that?? I havent seen any since I have been on here myself. But thought I would ask because that was one thing that made me want to throw hammers thru windows!

I swear to God, I think the 2015 World Series had a predetermined outcome :P

[OakDragon]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Yes, someone left the bread out in the rain

Never ending Breadstick

Urge to mention yeast... rising.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by turdfurgeson

I think I read somewhere, or maybe watching a youtube video for some game play tips that the Show does throw in some things to help steer games to certain results. The example given was that in road to the show mode, sometimes no matter what you do, the result will be pre determined, and it was most noticeable as a pitcher. The examle given was that some batters would foul off every pitch no matter how well it was thrown, trying to either induce a walk or hit. I have never seen that confirmed though.

FWIW I have't played The Show in probably 3-4 years but if The Show was going to cheat instead of fouling off all of those pitches why wouldn't it just drop one of them in for a hit?

[Biggio509]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoyalKC

This is a question that comes from my frustration with The Show games. As popular as The Show is, I know that there have been A LOT of people frustrated also with games seeming to be predetermined. Having big leads and, all of a sudden, their team turns into the Bad News Bears and they lose the game or going into unexplainable losing streaks. Like the AI says "Ok, enough! You had your moment."
Is there any complaints or comments of OOTP being like that?? I havent seen any since I have been on here myself. But thought I would ask because that was one thing that made me want to throw hammers thru windows!

Any wining or losing streak is unexplained. Considering most batters get a hit 25% of the time it is actually somewhat improbable a run will score in an inning.

I always laugh at players blaming their losing streaks on the game being rigged. All games are built on probability engines some are better than others. Old games probably just took into account ERA and BA to generate a probability of a hit. OOTP actually uses things a lot of variables. Control likely determines if it is a strike. If a strike eye probably factors into if a batter swings. If he swings contact and pitcher stuff likely factor into if the ball is hit. If hit power, movement, and gap help determine how far and if it is going to a place that is hard for a fielder to reach. Pull determines which side it goes to. They we have defender ratings to see if it is caught or not! The game does actually simulate what region of the ballpark a ball is hit to and whether the fielder will make the play.

The system is much more complex than a simple real world stats generating probabilities like the show or other games often use. I am not sure if these games even keep D stats. I know back in the 90's they didn't. OOTP was one of the first to account for D.

That being said just because the probability of a head is 1/2 doesn't mean if you flip a coin 10 times you can't get 10 heads or even 100 heads in 100 flips (lower probability). It means over 1000's of simulations the numbers will converge to some average. It doesn't mean the 27 Yankees can't lose 20 in a row although that would be very very rare.

A good test of this is look at your league totals. Another factor in the engine is league totals that adjust the probability so the league should get X hits, Y HRs etc. You will find that at the end of any given season the league totals are close but not exact. If it were predetermined and your league totals said 10,000 hits in a season it would always be 10,000 hits. If 10,000 hits were reached on the next to the last no one would get a hit on the last day and you would have a bunch of 30 inning games until a run was eventually walked in or multiple errors caused a run.

[Biggio509]

Originally Posted by Sweed

FWIW I have't played The Show in probably 3-4 years but if The Show was going to cheat instead of fouling off all of those pitches why wouldn't it just drop one of them in for a hit?

The cheats on those games are better player performance for the AI to make up for stick skills not oh crap he is winning tank him!

[turdfurgeson]

Originally Posted by Sweed

FWIW I have't played The Show in probably 3-4 years but if The Show was going to cheat instead of fouling off all of those pitches why wouldn't it just drop one of them in for a hit?

That is a good question. I never did too much digging into the theory because I really didn't care. The only pre determined outcome I noticed was that I would swing at everything.

[Bunktown Ballers]

Originally Posted by Matt Arnold

As I always say, it would take a lot more work to "script" the games than to just let the natural course play out.

Ah Ha......so y'all tried....LMAO...."joking"
I wouldn't willing pay $35 yearly if i figured it was predetermined

"Baseball has been very, very good to me"