Sir Spritze: It appears that the Neutralized Fielding Stats situation is under control in 17.7.51 (with one exception so far), but for some reason there are a bunch of players (this post will just be pitchers, starters at that) missing Neutered Batting Stats seasons that weren't missing them in 17.6.46. To wit:

- Henderson Alvarez 2011
- Brett Anderson 2010, 2012, 2013
- Dylan Axelrod 2011, 2012
- Scott T Baker 2005
- Chris Bassitt 2014
- Aaron Brooks 2014
- Clay Buchholz 2007-2009, 2011, 2013
- Mark Buehrle 2000, 2014
- Fausto Carmona 2006, 2009, 2012
- Carlos Carrasco 2009, 2010, 2013
- Jhoulys Chacin 2009
- Jesse Chavez 2008, 2011
- Bruce Chen 2004, 2007, 2014, 2015
- Wei-Yin Chen 2015
- Bartolo Colon 2009
- Jarred Cosart 2013
- John Danks 2015
- Kyle Davies 2015
- Samuel Deduno 2010-2012, 2015
- Felix Doubront 2010, 2011, 2015
- Kyle Drabek 2010, 2011, 2013-2015
- Danny Duffy 2012, 2013, 2015
- Roenis Elias 2015
- Marco Estrada 2008, 2009
- Buck Farmer 2014
- Scott Feldman 2005-2007, 2011
- Michael Fiers 2011
- Gavin Floyd 2007, 2015
- Michael Foltynewicz 2014
- Matt Garza 2006
- Kevin Gausman 2015
- Kyle Gibson 2013
- Marco Gonzales 2015
- Gio Gonzalez 2008, 2009
- Miguel A Gonzalez 2012
- Kendall Graveman 2014, 2015
- Sonny Gray 2013
- Shane Greene 2014
- Zack Greinke 2006
- Jeremy Guthrie 2004-2006
- Jason Hammel 2006, 2008
- J A Happ 2013
- Matt Harrison 2008, 2013, 2014
- Jeremy Hellickson 2010, 2014
- Felix Hernandez 2005
- Derek Holland 2010, 2011, 2014, 2015
- T J House 2015
- David Huff 2011-2013
- Phil Hughes 2007-2009, 2011
- Drew Hutchison 2015
- Hisashi Iwakuma 2012
- Erik C Johnson 2013, 2015

Also, Kendall Graveman is missing Neutered Pitching and Fielding Stats for 2014. Thank you very much for all your efforts with this. I'll keep hammering away at it, but that's all for today. :)

The files have not changed between 46 and 51 but I'll see if I can tell what may have changed in the program.

I checked 7 of these and they are purrfect so I suspect something changed in OOTP but I have no idea what. Let me know if you get any suspicions.

These players had no AB's IRL and so have no neutered batting stats. This is by request of the powers that be.

Graveman gets dunked in 2014 by the Ted Williams formula. Fixed these by rejiggering the formula.

I do see a lot of American League pitchers on that list.

That's because that's all I've been able to wade through so far.

I thought the whole point of neutered stats was to fill in the gaps left by seasons without stats. Why would the powers that be not want stats for said seasons? So is that what changed between 17.6.46 and 17.7.51? :confused:

Also, a bunch of players have disappeared since 17.6.46 if you start a historical in 2015 (in order to see how current players are affected historically). 174 players to be exact. There were 1352 players in the 2015 historical I used to check for bugs in 17.6.46, and there are now 1178 players in 17.7.51. R A Dickey is one of the players missing and he pitched 200 innings in 2015, so it's not necessarily a matter of guys who didn't play in 2015 that are missing. :confused:

Here are players from the AL East who have "been disappeared" since 17.6.46:

BAL: Cesar Cabral, Oliver Drake, Jason Garcia, Mychal Givens, Steve Johnson

BOS: Jonathan Aro, Heath Hembree, Dalier Hinojosa, Brian Johnson, Noe Ramirez

NYY: Andrew Bailey, Danny Burawa, Caleb Cotham, Jose De Paula, Nick Goody, Jacob Lindgren, Chris Martin, Diego Moreno, Rico Noel, James Pazos, Jose A Ramirez, Nick Rumbelow, Matt Tracy, Mason Williams

TBR: Jeff Beliveau, Andrew Bellatti, Preston Guilmet, Jake McGee, C J Riefenhauser, Enny Romero, Everett Teaford, Kirby Yates

TOR: Andrew Albers, Miguel Castro, Steve Delabar, R A Dickey, Colt Hynes, Rob Rasmussen, Marcus Stroman, Ryan Tepera

If you're counting, that's 40 so far from one division.

The stats are based on zero AB's and zero will always be the AB so there is no point to these zero batting records.

Fixed when I rejiggered the Ted Williams formula to take account of Pitchers who never batted while still dumping batters who pitched very little while keeping batters who really were 2-way players or switched to or from being a pitcher

How did R A Dickey get lumped in there then? :confused: Or Rico Noel who was an utility player (DH/RF) for the Yankees in 2015? Or Mason Williams (CF) for the Yankees in 2015?

I can only reply that the fix is in for them.

This is part of the how:SELECT [750PitchingCareer].playerID, [300/50MinimumBatting].SumOfG AS BattingGames, IIf([300/50MinimumBatting.sumofg] Is Null,1,[sumofg]/[300/50MinimumBatting.sumofg]) AS KillThesePitchingRecords, [300/50MinimumBatting].TooFew300G, CInt(([sumofipouts]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewIPOuts, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfG, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfIPouts, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfW, CInt(([sumofw]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewW, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfL, CInt(([sumofl]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewL, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfGS, CInt(([sumofgs]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewGS, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfCG, CInt(([sumofcg]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewCG, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfNewSHO, CInt(([sumofnewsho]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewSho, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfSV, CInt(([sumofsv]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewSV, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfNewH, CInt(([sumofnewH]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewH, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewER, CInt(([sumofnewer]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewER, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfNewHR, CInt(([sumofnewHR]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewHR, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewbb, CInt(([sumofnewbb]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewBB, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewso, CInt(([sumofnewso]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewSO, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewibb, CInt(([sumofnewibb]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewIBB, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewwp, CInt(([sumofnewwp]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewWP, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewhbp, CInt(([sumofnewhbp]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewHBP, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewbk, CInt(([sumofnewbk]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewBK, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfBFP, CInt(([sumofbfp]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewBFP, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfGF, CInt(([sumofgf]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewGF, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewr, CInt(([sumofnewr]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewR, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewsh, CInt(([sumofnewsh]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewSH, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewsf, CInt(([sumofnewsf]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewSF, [750PitchingCareer].SumOfnewgidp, CInt(([sumofnewgidp]/[sumofg])*[toofew300g]) AS NewGIDP
FROM [300/50MinimumBatting] RIGHT JOIN 750PitchingCareer ON [300/50MinimumBatting].playerID = [750PitchingCareer].playerID
WHERE (((IIf([300/50MinimumBatting.sumofg] Is Null,1,[sumofg]/[300/50MinimumBatting.sumofg]))>0.02))
ORDER BY [750PitchingCareer].playerID;

:@@: Whoa!

Thanks Spritze for your quick response to my previous posts. I ran a quick sim starting in 1961 with the newest rosters to find duplicated players, with the same name (removing special characters and spaces) and birth month. Some were mentioned in my post from last week. Here are the results:

Bryan Price 1986-11
CC Sabathia 1980-07
Chuck Smith 1969-10
D'Angelo Jimenez 1977-12
Darren O'Day 1982-10
Eric O'Flaherty 1985-02
Erisbel Arruebarrena 1990-03
Freddy Garcia 1975-06 (the pitcher with majors ID garcifr03 should have minors ID garcia003fre)
Gabe Gonzalez 1972-05
J C Hartman 1934-04
Jeff C D'Amico 1975-12
Jeff M D'Amico 1974-11
Jesus de la Rosa 1953-08
Jim Morris 1964-01
Johan Santana 1979-03
John D'Acquisto 1951-12
Jorge De La Rosa 1981-04
Jose D Ortiz 1977-06
Julio Ramirez 1977-08
Kevin Nicholson 1976-03
La Schelle Tarver 1959-01
Mark Watson 1974-01
Michael Stutes 1986-09
Mike de la Hoz 1938-10
Mike O'Connor 1980-08
Neil Weber 1972-12
Oil Can Boyd 1959-10
Peter O'Brien 1990-07
Rafael Furcal 1977-10
Randy St. Claire 1960-08
RC Stevens 1934-07
Rick Greene 1971-01
Rob Woodward 1962-09
Rodrigo Lopez 1975-12
Roosevelt Brown 1975-08
Ryan O'Rourke 1988-04
Shawn O'Malley 1987-12
Steve Schrenk 1968-11
Tike Redman 1977-03
Tom Jacquez 1975-12
Tony La Russa 1944-10
UL Washington 1953-10
Willie Harris 1978-06
Wily Mo Pena 1982-01

I'll give my computer a rest and look for duplicates pre-1961 in a few days.

It appears from your list that all these players have already been fixed. Those fixes will appear in the next full update due out in a month or two.

Oh that's good to hear. At least I got some programming practice and my laptop didn't explode in the sim, which I do admit is super fast now, I wouldn't have tried this with older versions.

Spritze: I've found by importing these players (Cesar Cabral and Oliver Drake so far) that the reason they aren't showing up in my game is because they have no neutralized stats at all for any season. This is not good for those of us that play with neutralized stats. Could you possibly take a look at this? Thanks. This now includes R A Dickey, who has been in the big leagues since 2001.

EDIT: I can dig up all 174 of them if need be. Thanks.

Also Will Harris/Willie Harris problem still exists, but Jerome Williams/Jeff Williams issue appears to have been fixed.

These fixes will not be released until the NEXT full update, in a month or two.

You are just looking at the old files that have no changes applied.

By old files, do you mean 17.7.51?

No changes will have been processed until later this summer. I believe .51 is a 3D fix you don't need special glasses for.

When I go to Historical Exhibition and play the 1920 World Series there is a missing player. Steve O'Neill is not on the Cleveland Indians roster even though he was their starting catcher and played 7 games in the 1920 WS. However, if I set up an exhibition game with that Indians team against any other team then O'Neill does appear on the roster.

grmagne, I'll bet O'Neill is someone whose ID has changed. I'll make the change(s) to the World Series rosters file.

ETA: I made more than a dozen ID changes and sent the updated file to Markus.

The known duplicate players will have been fixed in the next upgrade to be released in a few days. If you find any remaining they will either have been unreported or I messed up when fixing them. Even though a few hundred were reported this lead to several thousand additional fixes.

Thanks!

This is confirmed fixed in the next patch. :)

I just downloaded the beta, thanks for the updates on the duplicated players (Johan Santana, Furcal, etc). In a 2001 import, there are some fringy players I reported a bit later, like D'Angelo Jimenez, Jeff D'Amico (both of them), Willie Harris with two copies. Are these going to be fixed in the official patch coming up soon?

There are two major league Willie Harris's and one minor league one. I just renamed one of the major league ones Willie R. Harris so you can tell them apart easier. There are also several William, Will, Bill and Billy Harris's.

D'Angelo Jimenez, Jeff D'Amico (both of them) are in the update and were corrected.

I do not know when the newer files will show up in the game. Not my call.

So many Oil Cans
 

Historical with affiliated minors. Started in 1988. Now, it's the first day of the off-season. Minors database loads and a second Oil Can Boyd appears as a free agent. After checking, I see that regular Oil Can has only MLB stats in his real stats, and new Oil Can has only MiLB stats in his. I'm guess that somehow the two should be merged into a genuine Oil Can.

*FWIW, I started this league with one of the previous builds (don't remember which now) and I am currently in the new build 54.

This was fixed a while ago. Don't know when OOTP will release it.

In case you're wondering, I made a somewhat comprehensive list of duplicate players (1961 onwards) from an older build a few posts up... many of them (like Johan Santana and Rafael Furcal) have been corrected in the latest OOTP release.

Yay!!! I'm happy the fixes made it in. Are there any more needed?

There are two Cesar Cabrals (1 played in the majors) and they both have Pitching and fielding entries but no batting since they never did that. Oliver Drake has the same challenge as well. R.A. (Robert) Dickey has all 3.

Seeing a few minor league career stat lines showing up as MLB stat lines because similar franchises became major league ones later. I started a 1970 season. Tony Perez played for the San Diego Padres in 1963 and 1964 when the Padres were a AAA affiliate of the Reds in the PCL. These are showing up as MLB stat lines in Perez's career stats.

I'm seeing this on a few other players' career numbers. Howie Moss has all of his years with the minor league Baltimore team in the 40's showing up that he played for the St. Louis Browns of the MLB instead.

Thanks!

This is not a database issue so I bugged it.

Any idea when the fix will be made so all infielders aren't rated 50 for fielding?

Should be in the next full update?

Can we expect the next full update by September or will it be part of the road to release for OOTP18?

AFAIK In a couple of weeks perchance?

Ugh! Back to 16 I go.

I have moved on to other games for the time being. I think by this time next year historical minors will be a wonderful innovation that work as they were designed to work. In the meantime, I have a half dozen outstanding games on my hard drive, and that's just the sports sims. I'll give the 1919 Texas League another shot after the fielding is fixed.

I think I will be ready to roll too as soon as the fielding gets fixed.

So just for kicks I decided to start a 1919 fast sim with real minors. Sim the 1919 season. Everything seems fine. I then sim 1920. 1921 roles around and the Pacific League is introduced. Problem is, only the Los Angeles Angels have any players. Sim ahead to the start of the 1922 season and the Angels are still the only Pacific Coast team with any players.

If you have no draft the players go to their real teams. The PCL will get theirs.

With a draft the MLB teams grab ALL the players so the PCL is pretty empty except for the affiliated Angels.

As the PCL ages it will eventually fill even with a draft in operation.

No draft was had. Pacific Coast league empty except for Angels.

I just ran this myownself with no draft and all PCL teams are full. There are 221 players in the PCL.

Alright, just for kicks, I repeated the same process as before and setup another historical with real minors starting in 1919. No draft. Only team in the Pacific Coast league with players is the Los Angeles Angels. By 1923, San Francisco gets 14 players, Oakland 1 and Sacramento 1. Los Angeles has 28. The rest of the team are still player free.

Not sure why this would make a difference, but I'm not using recalc.

Another thing I've noticed is some of the Texas League teams, have as many as 47 players on their roster. Fort Worth 47. Shreveport 43. Houston 40.

When the minors start in 1919, the PCL players who played at the time are in the game as free agents. They get snapped up by the major leagues and the Texas League and don't automatically get transferred to the PCL when the time comes. (We don't do minor league transactions). The reason the Angels are full is that they're affiliated with the Cubs. Most of the players will not be the ones who were actually on that team.

So the reason you have no PCL players is that you haven't limited the rosters at the Texas League level. Cut them to realistic levels, and you'll have players in the PCL.

Because of the piecemeal start to the leagues, the 1919 Texas League will snap up the players who were really in the PCL at the time. When I start my replay, I'll disallow AI roster changes at both the MLB and Texas League level and do historical transactions manually. That's the only way to keep the players where they actually were. Then those players will be available for the PCL in 1921.

Thanks. I have one question though, what is a good limit to set for these minor league teams? Setting a limit won't result in really good major league players being released, signed released, signed released....signed released, signed released will it? I know limits do that sometimes?

I'm not concerned as much with players playing for the correct teams, as I am with having a legitimate league history. When you go to a season and look at the league leaders it's looks ridiculous to see only Angel players.

I wonder if the problem is the reserve clause? Going to try the same setup, but use free agency and see what happens.