real historical transactions?
 

Once in a game and you shut it off a few years into the sim?

not sure what your question is

i started a new league with real transactions and i'm about 15 years into the league and i would like to shut it off now but it seems that the option to turn it on and off is no longer in the game setup under historical tab. Is it not posible to shut off the transactions once the league is started?

I think you may need to do it during pre-season

I thought that option was only available during universe setup. It would be very convenient to be able to switch real life transactions and lineups on and off between seasons. Do you know how to do that?

Nope it should be there between seasons too under the historical tab (at least as I remember) you just may need to do it around January 1st.

tried to get the option to come back. tried preseason spring training and on before and after jan 1st don't think you can get it back.

i figured it out. I added minor leagues and it screwed everything up by getting rid of that option when you create minor leagues. My fault thanks for the help.

So to be 100% clear on this.

If one start with transactions ON and with Minor Leagues , lets say sometime in the mid 1970s.

One should then be able to turn it OFF once you got into the 1980s.

I didn´t get that misshap with Minor leagues. Whatever do they intervene and makes things impssible ???

I don't believe you can have minor leagues and real transactions but I've never tested it.

Probably not, since Minors doesn´t seam to have any historical importance in OOTP. One thing (at least on AAA level) that should lift the game a step.

Ive been working on a transaction file for the 19th century. I found that i could use some of the dates from retrosheet but there are sometimes i cant use the actual date because i think it may be cause problems.

For example when a player is signed to a new team in March. If players old team has folded the game would look to the transaction file and since the team is no longer active it may mess things up but im not sure if thats the case.

Never the less im just having players released by the end of the year and signing with new team the next year. Im gonna test the 1871 season and see how good it works with players being drafted to their correct teams. I think it will help when teams fold because the players should be in my file since obviously they had to with a real team.

I have to manually make the transactions but i dont think that will be a problem as i should just have to check the date in my file and it will tell me the next date i need to release or sign a player. Plus it gives me more time to watch each season more closer instead of just simming the whole season at once.
Anyway if it works ill share the file if anyones interested. I still have a lot of work to go. I still have to figure out the best way to handle transactions where theres no date for a player moving to another team during the season. If he was traded after the season its easy cause like i said i just release players at the end of the year and sign them at the start of the next year.

Been working on this off and on since October. Wish there was an easier way to do it but i dont think theres a way to do it automatically since i have to manually check each player. I dont think retrosheet has all the transactions and theres also the problem i mentioned above.

The transaction file that comes with OOTP has the real life transactions 1871-1900 already in it, formulated exactly as you have outlined. OOTP simply won't use any transaction pre-1900 since it doesn't come with real 19th century play or teams or schedules. OOTP has been programmed to ignore those transactions. This ignoration may pose a challenge to you when getting OOTP to play your transaction file.

If you do all transactions by hand then no problem, you can do anything you wish by hand. Left or right, it makes no difference.

I could only open that up in notepad. Is it available on excel. I am trying to make a transaction file that will match up with the actual teams. So players are not being traded from teams that have already folded. Also to keep the history of player from showing he played 0 games for team since he was traded before start of the season.

It is available.

You'll have to find the fella in charge of the transaction file. He is a beta team member and has posted there and on the regular forums.

After thinking about it i dont think i can use it because i still have to look up players that missed seasons in order to put them on the correct teams. If the information in that file is taken from Retrosheet , they dont have a lot of those in their transaction files. It just shows on players batting stats that he missed some seasons.

How does a transaction work if the player is injured at the time of being traded ?

Injured players can´t be traded, can they ?

Same with stuff like the AI is cutting a player that later in that year was traded historically. What happens then. He is just free and any team can sign him.

I think so many things can happen that messing up transactions or am I wrong ?

Well if your using historical transactions then you are putting players on teams they played for regardless of whether they are injured or not. Otherwise you would be using a historical setup with more of a what if situation. If you are using historical transactions as they happened in real life it doesnt matter if Babe Ruth is injured he should be traded to the Yankees in 1920. But that does bring the question of should you eliminate CEI when using real transactions? You cant really have real trades if Babe Ruth suffers a CEI in 1919 and is forced to retire.

Transactions On = No Disabled Players and no injuries and all players are on the active roster, no minor leagues, no cutting, no baby whiners.

The OOTP transaction list contains but is not limited to the Retrosheet data. As I disremember an extra 23,000 transactions are included inclusively to make the OOTP transaction file the definitive transaction file on the planet Earth and its environs. That includes Mars for those of you of an Ares nature, but not Venus as zero girls are included in the transaction file. This is not an oversight, girls are not allowed.

So if I´m not stupid. I might be ;-(

If one use Spritze or Gambo DB (that needs a lot of Minor Leagues) the historical transactions will work with top players that are assumed to be on active roster when the historical transaction took place.

So one gets a 75% (perhaps) correct transaction setup over the years.

In my setup I was hoping to play out some 5-10 years before jumping in as a GM. I was hoping that the AI during this time hasn´t completly changed the baseball world during those 5-10 years, but slaved under the historical transaction and lineups ON "rules".
I can live with that not every single transactions over these years has happend, but would be happy to see the bigger trades done.

Question then would be to untick historical transactions when I enter to see a totally new baseball world emerge.

This way I hope to have some of those more detailed stats, pitcher vs batter, left vs right and hundreds more that can´t be done from the start since they are not on any stat record for Lahman.

Am I out on deept water ???


ADJUSTED:

YES I am !!!

One can´t even compine historical transactions with minors, so this project goes in trash.

The sad part to me about the transaction rules is that the transaction database actually also includes when players changed organziations while in the minors, when they were drafted and also has many for players who were added in the Spritze/Gambo databases.

Where is the option found in the menu? I have tried to create historic leagues, but this option never appears.

How to create a Historic League , following the wizard or menu, and have this appear?

The transaction file is simply Way More Awesome than the silly transaction process included in OOTP can cope with. OOTP needs to catch up. Maybe someday? After 19th Century baseball is made functional.

Now that pisses me off to no end. We have all the 19th Century transactions in the Tranny Database but OOTP has been trained by Markus to ignore them as well as to ignore the league structures and the team movements. What is up with that?

Well we know the game can work with real team movement. Could the problem be with when the teams fold. Sometimes players were just loaned to teams back then. What about if a player is released in March from a team that folded the previous season.
I would like to use the real transactions as they happened but im not sure if it would be too much programming to get that to work. For me i prefer having the players on the right teams and playing close to the same amount of games as real life but im not sure if the game can handle the weirdness of the 19th century transactions.

Anyway thats why i prefer the simple approach. An active player is either released or signed from free agency. Or a player is signed from unretirement. Would be great if ootp puts players coming back on their new teams. I prefer to release all players at the end of the year and sign them to new teams in January unless they played for different teams during the season. But in anycase they are either released or signed.
No loans, players not reporting, team folded from which the player being traded layed for.
I may be wrong but i think right now is too keep 19th century transactions as simple as possible for now.
Of course i could be wrong.

It can be done by hand but the 'game' doesn't follow 19th century reality even one tiny bit. It is so bad they should be ashamed of themselves for pretending 19th Century play is included. It is only 20th Century play in the years 1871-1900.

Well i cant really complain because 19th century was probably put in as a gift. For the longest time it wasnt in the game and i can understand why. How do you simulate the constant changes in the rules back then? 8 strikes for strikeout then 4. Players loaned to teams and never playing for one of them, erratic schedules, missing data in the database, parks that have incomplete data.
I would like 19th century play to be as close to reality as possible but for now i think we will have to take what we can get.
Maybe if we could organize all the problems we have with 19th century play and things we see wrong it would help Markus see what he can fix. But i think we need to remember that most likely Markus never intended to put it in the game.

Markus made one big move for the 19th century in the last patch when he put in a global fatigue reset. There are just too many franchise changes, teams folding, etc, to ever expect 1871-1891 historical leagues to be out of the box historical. But 19th century gets a little better every year. Maybe OOTP14 will make some more progress.

I agree.

I'll just lower my expectations to less than zero then since that seems to be the consensus.

I'm just trying to be realistic. You have all of the franchise changes to make, and if that actually happened, I'd just be more upset about the scoring of earned runs. I do think that next year Markus should try to back up to 1892 on a historical basis. That should at least be within reach. I just don't think he'd ever try to swallow all those structural changes in one bite.

Other than with the 1871-75 NA, the franchise changes aren't that bad. It's just a matter of getting historical leagues to recognize when clubs switch leagues, when they begin and end, and when leagues pass into and out of existence. I suspect the bigger issue would be getting the AI to handle the kind of player usage typical in the small rosters of the time.

All this is contained in the Lahman teams.csv PLUS the real as played schedules exist as well as the scheduled schedules.


The only challenge I find is the players who both pitch and then play the field on their non-pitch days. Other than that small rosters work quite well. AND that should be fixed for 20th century play anyway.

But OOTP needs to understand it. As it stands now it only understands teams moving to new locations and teams being added. It has no capacity to make sense of clubs nor leagues passing into and out of existence. (To me that wouldn't seem to be a big problem to address, but then I'm not privy to the way OOTP is coded on such matters.)

Excluding the 1871-75 NA and 1876 NL, that is. There were no published league schedules for those seasons. (One can probably fashion a reasonable facsimile for the 1876 NL, but the NA is another matter entirely.)

Even 11- and 12-man rosters?

How were rosters that small set up and used? Presumably 1 full time pitcher, then one of each other position, plus 1 or 2 utility guys (who could probably also pitch)?

That's right. There were some teams that only used 11-12 men all year. There were a lot more who just would get some semipro player to fill in for one game when they got shorthanded. The 1876 St. Louis Browns only used 10 players all season long. The 10-11 man rosters were standard.

Most of the roster expansion up through the end of the century was pitching staffs. The 1901 Tigers only used 12 position players all year, counting Harry Lochhead's one game played. The champion White Sox started the season with 11 position players but released Dave Brain after 5 games and played with 10 for over half the season before picking up Jimmy Burke and Pop Foster.

When I say the 19th century game works fairly well, I am not saying that you can just sim a season and expect decent results. OOTP AI is never going to change pitchers by having the starter trade places with the right fielder. But you can control the lineups and substitutions yourself and play out games. You will get decent results except for earned runs. The biggest obstacle to that method was pitcher fatigue, and Markus has solved that with the global fatigue reset in the latest patch. All of the workarounds now actually work. It has taken a long time for the game to get to this point, and I prefer to see the glass as half full.

Why not? OOTP used to do this 7 versions ago. Maybe it can again.

I don't see the glass in any special way but all the bourbon and bonbons that used to be in it are gone.

The problem is though that those work-arounds only apply to human controlled teams, so you;re still going to get some issues with teams you don't control.

I'm an old APBA/Strat/DMB player. I have no problem with being in commissioner mode and controlling all the teams.

I might be wrong, but if you're playing out games you can only control one side though, can't you?