Online League Poll:

[coljesep]

Just curious...

Those of you who are in an OOTP online league version 10 through 12, I'm curious... how many of you are in leagues where the Commish owns a team?

[Cooleyvol]

Vast majority will be my guess.

[coljesep]

probably, but that's why I gave options... I've never stayed in a league longer than 2 seasons where the commish owned a team.

[sdodd]

Originally Posted by coljesep

probably, but that's why I gave options... I've never stayed in a league longer than 2 seasons where the commish owned a team.

Can I ask why??

[coljesep]

Well 2 reasons really.

The first, I run a Front Page Sports (much older sim) league in which I've never owned a team. So for example, I know ways a commish has an advantage even if they aren't doing it intentionally.

And the second, it could be bad luck but I never seem to find a league where the commish is historically bad. It always seems I enter a league when they either a) win their division often b) win titles or c) won titles in the past and now have a ridiculous farm system.

It's just my preference really... curious about others.

[ukhotstove]

They have an advantage that they spend more time with the file, looking over the players and such when they process trades and such. Don't think it's anything else but knowing the players in the league better than the other GM's, also throw in the fact that most commish I bet are only in the league they run so concentrate on just one league.

[Killebrew]

Originally Posted by coljesep

I've never stayed in a league longer than 2 seasons where the commish owned a team.

Staying longer than 2 seasons in a league where the commish does not run a team seems pretty unrealistic. I believe you would stick around in that scenario, I just cannot imagine a league like that surviving much longer than 2 seasons.

[coljesep]

ukhotstove:
well I'm not going to blame them for only being in 1 league. Everybody else can be in 1 league if they want.

There's a sense of trust with the commish of your league, a sense you don't have with every owner. You're never gonna see a heated rivalry with a commish (or at least I never have), and to me it's easier for a commish to wheel and deal because he likely have a good relationship with every owner plus as you said... he knows every player in his league.

And look I'm sure a bunch of commish's can say they are too prideful or honest to look at things other owners can't. But it's not all of them.

[coljesep]

Originally Posted by Killebrew

Staying longer than 2 seasons in a league where the commish does not run a team seems pretty unrealistic. I believe you would stick around in that scenario, I just cannot imagine a league like that surviving much longer than 2 seasons.

Killebrew: Well I've run my FPS one for 18 seasons (9 real years)

I've been in an OOTP 6.5 league that's been going 10+ seasons and 6 real
years

and an OOTPX one that just finished it's 3rd year in under 2 real years

So I'm not sure what's so unrealistic about it?

[Bluenoser]

I just want to add the Commish does NOT have an advantage because he spends more time with the file or because he has a better relationship with owners or because he knows every player in his league.

While he may well spend more time with the file, and he may well know every player in his league, these are simply NOT advanatges.

Every owner in the league has the same ability/opportunity to spend more time with the file, to build good relationships with other owners, and to get to know all the players in the league.

If the owners don't take the time to do this but the Commish does, well, that's on them. It's certainly not because the Commish has an advantage.


The way I look at it, and always have, either you trust the Commish or you don't. If you do, stay in the league, if you don't, then leave.

I can guarantee you that the vast majority of OOTP Leagues are run by straight up, honest, Baseball Loving, people who are only interested in furthering their enjoyment of OOTP via competing with other human owners.

Cheaters exist everywhere, not just in OOTP. It's been my experience they don't last long and once they're discovered they will have a hard time getting into another league because the community here is tight knit. Commishes aren't hesitant to pass on cheater info to other Commishes.

Whether you are the Commish or an owner, you and you alone control your reputation. Build a bad one by cheating, and guess what, you won't be playing in many online leagues. Build a good one and guess what, most leagues will be glad to have you.

[coljesep]

Bluenoser: I think we will need to agree to disagree here.

When you are a Commish you get a better understanding of every owners strengths and weaknesses and also get to figure out the types of players they value most in trade. Sure, regular owners can do it also but we aren't the ones submitting in-game.

Plus, no matter what you say... people look at their commish differently than they look at just another owner. A commish can come off with less of an agenda when discussing players/tactics etc while another owner can have same convo but be taken with a grain of salt.

I'd call them commish intangibles. A good commish will get more out of his league than a great owner in my view.

And again, it works for some. I just find it to be very questionable at times.

[TDO]

never been in an OOTP league but i have been in various other online leagues and have ran one league since 2003 in real life and still do to this day. I think a commish running a team is a non issue. I hope to join a OOTP league someday and its not going to be an issue for me either way.

[Jigga]

i dont see it as an advantage at all. We all have the chance to learn what owners like and dislike. Its your choice to talk to other gms and find out things they like. If you choose not to talk to other gms then maybe the issue is you and not the commish. Personally i dont see why a commish wouldnt own a team. If a commish owns a team its less likely for him to just let the league go since he has something invested other then just sitting and watching. By the way, A commish who does not own a team can still help owners that may be his friend so it doesnt change the shady commish situation

[Bluenoser]

Originally Posted by coljesep

Bluenoser: I think we will need to agree to disagree here.

When you are a Commish you get a better understanding of every owners strengths and weaknesses and also get to figure out the types of players they value most in trade. Sure, regular owners can do it also but we aren't the ones submitting in-game.

Not sure why you want to agree to disagree, I said the same thing. A Commish may well acquire a better knowledge because he spends more time, but it's not an advanatge simply because everyone else in the league has the same opportunity.

Originally Posted by coljesep

Plus, no matter what you say... people look at their commish differently than they look at just another owner. A commish can come off with less of an agenda when discussing players/tactics etc while another owner can have same convo but be taken with a grain of salt.

I'd call them commish intangibles. A good commish will get more out of his league than a great owner in my view.

And again, it works for some. I just find it to be very questionable at times.

Not me - I don't look at the Commish any differently than I do other owners. I feel that way as a past Commish and as an owner.

How/what do you measure to determine who's getting more out of a league?

Don't take this personal, because it's not, but I believe you're too skeptical and not trusting enough. I could understand the concerns more were you making a major investment, but it's a game, played online for free. The only cost, which is identical for the Commish and owners I might add, is the purchase of the game. (Note - I realize the Commish also pays for internet space)

Anyway, you have your opinion and I certainly respect that. I've been playing in online leagues since before OOTP came along, and I've never had a reason to be that concerned. If I ever did, I'd leave the league. Too easy.

[maxxavier]

Originally Posted by coljesep

Just curious...

Those of you who are in an OOTP online league version 10 through 12, I'm curious... how many of you are in leagues where the Commish owns a team?

I'm in a few leagues and they all have commish's who run a team. However, I am a commish in a league who does NOT run a team and my guys like it that way as I do... There's NEVER a question of bias or cheating.

[gollum65]

I'm in 2 leagues. In one I'm a GM in a modern day league and have been in it since it started in OOTP 9 and the commish in that league has always owned the same team. I've never once questioned his integrity nor do I think he has any advantage over anyone else in the league.

I'm the commish of the other league, a historical league currently playing it's 1971 MLB season. I don't believe I have any advantage over anyone else in the league. My team has been the Cincinnati Reds and while I did win the first WS of our league I haven't been to the playoffs since, nor do I have a very strong farm system.

I don't believe the Commish has any advantage because they "have more time with the league file so they know every player". Just because we have the time doesn't mean we know every player. Do I know the names of the players in my league, and to a great degree know who's good and who isn't? Sure. But even if I wanted to trade for players doens't mean the other GM is going to agree. It takes 2 to tango.

The only way I see that a Commish has any type of advantage is that they have access to the player editor. But I've never seen a Commish tinker with it without the GMs in the league knowing they did. It's usually pretty obvious if a player's ratings have been messed with.

[Killebrew]

Originally Posted by coljesep

Killebrew: Well I've run my FPS one for 18 seasons (9 real years)

I've been in an OOTP 6.5 league that's been going 10+ seasons and 6 real
years

and an OOTPX one that just finished it's 3rd year in under 2 real years

You mention you're a commish in the 9 year FPS league. I assume that means that is an online league and you have never run a team in the league?

Regarding the other leagues mentioned - same scenario? All these leagues run by a commish who has never owned one of the teams? Could you possibly mention which online leagues these are?

[TPinrose]

Originally Posted by Killebrew

You mention you're a commish in the 9 year FPS league. I assume that means that is an online league and you have never run a team in the league?

Regarding the other leagues mentioned - same scenario? All these leagues run by a commish who has never owned one of the teams? Could you possibly mention which online leagues these are?

The only one I've ever seen was called Dog Days Baseball, I think.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Killebrew

Staying longer than 2 seasons in a league where the commish does not run a team seems pretty unrealistic. I believe you would stick around in that scenario, I just cannot imagine a league like that surviving much longer than 2 seasons.

Not sure if it matters much, but one of the two leagues I run, I have never owned a team and it is a few years old. The other league (the older one) has been around since OOTP8, and while I did run a team at the start, I was not the commish then. I haven't run a team in that league in several years, ever since I took over as commish.


That said, I believe the majority of owners in my league (including some that say they miss competing against me in the league), have often said they wouldn't mind if I ever decided to run a team. I choose not to though for many different reasons. I believe they feel that way though because they have developed a trust for me and honestly feel that I would never do anything to hurt the league, regardless if I own a team.

I believe there are many very reputable commissioners out there that have a similar trust from the people that play in their league. They have earned that trust over a long time and I would fully trust playing in a league they run even if they also run a team there. I likely won't ever run a team in a league that I commish, but I also wouldn't hesitate a second to play in a league run by many of the different commissioners that I have met through these forums or various leagues over the past decade.

[phenom]

I've only ever been commish of I think three leagues. Two of them I owned a team but the third I did not. I think I enjoyed running the league without a team best, because I could focus on league stuff without worrying about who I was gonna pick 18th in the draft and the like. Also, whenever an owner left the league, I'd minimally take over that team until I could find an owner, to at least allow them to retain their level of competitiveness. It worked really well.