The Milestones

[NYY #23]

It's time to talk about those important baseball milestones once again. 300 wins, 500 home runs, 3000 hits. The numbers that virtually guaranteed enshrinement into the Hall of Fame (at least before the steroid era). Bobby Mathews and 297 wins sounds much less impressive than Early Winn and 300 wins. Would Mathews be in the Hall of Fame with 3 more wins? Would it have taken so long for Sam Rice to get in the Hall of Fame if he collected 13 more hits?

So for this dynasty I will be focusing on those milestones. We'll see how members of the actual clubs end up doing, who can achieve those magical numbers again, and those who come out of nowhere to surprise you.

As I like to do when running a replay like this, recalc will be off and I'll be using the OOTP development engine to rewrite history. So Babe Ruth could bomb and Larry Sheets could turn into the next Babe Ruth. I find it fun to see who comes out of nowhere to surprise. As I attempted to do last time I'll be using the Gambo-Spritze database so players could debut sooner than they did in real life, and we will get a chance to see some Negro League and Japanese players.

It will take a few years before things start to get interesting, but I'll be following along with the real life members of the clubs and update on their progress, and follow along once a player reaches a certain point. We'll take a look at the categories that we will be following next, and then what it will take to become enshrined in my 'Milestone Hall of Fame'.

I had some time today to get things set-up and prepared and did some testing so I thought I'd get things started. I plan to officially post some details about each of the milestones I'll be following, and plan to get in one or two seasons before travelling next week, and then the pace will start to pick up.

Now's the time for any predictions on who the all-time leaders will be in any of the categories -

Home Runs
Hits
Stolen Bases
Wins
Strikeouts
Saves

Recalc is off, so I expect we'll see at least a few surprises.

[scott1964]

Originally Posted by NYY #23

Now's the time for any predictions on who the all-time leaders will be in any of the categories -

Home Runs Babe Ruth
Hits somebody in 20th century
Stolen Bases Piggy Ward
Wins Bill Vinton
Strikeouts Frank Mountain
Saves somebody in 20th century

Recalc is off, so I expect we'll see at least a few surprises.

[deandean1998]

Home Runs Calvin Pickering
Hits Roy Hobbs
Stolen Bases Manny Rameriez
Wins Clay Bucholtz
Strikeouts Babe ruth
Saves Mark Prior

now for real
================================================== ==========
Home Runs Ted Williams
Hits Ty Cobb
Stolen Bases Ty Cobb
Wins Pedro Martinez
Strikeouts Cy Young
Saves Rollie Fingers
Best team - REDSOX BABY!

[mirrf]

Originally Posted by NYY #23

Home Runs
Hits
Stolen Bases
Wins
Strikeouts
Saves

HR: Mel Ott
Hits: Stan the Man
SB: The Rickey
W: Christy Mathewson
K: J.R. Richard
S: Lee Smith

[Nick Soulis]

Originally Posted by mirrf

HR: Mel Ott
Hits: Stan the Man
SB: The Rickey
W: Christy Mathewson
K: J.R. Richard
S: Lee Smith

HR: Ted Williams
Hits: Joe DiMaggio
SB: Ty Cobb
W: Cy Young
K: Rube Waddell
S: Mo Rivera

[NYY #23]

Rather than go through and list each member of the milestones that I'll be watching I thought I would just list the categories. I've done that before, and that information is not hard to find, plus I'll be pointing that out once the players make their debut.

300 Win Club - 24 pitchers have past this milestone. All members of the club who are eligible have been elected to the Hall of Fame, and while I'm sure we will see another member it definitely is still a rarity. Once an active player reaches 200 I'll plan on following them until they retire.

3000 Strikeouts - With 16 members of this club, it's even more exclusive than wins, and another where it has been almost a virtual guarantee of being elected to the Hall of Fame. Once a player passes 2000 I'll follow.

300 Saves - 23 players have passed the 300 save milestones, and the names on the list are definitely not as impressive, but there is something fun and quirky about closers. I'll begin to follow active players once they pass the 200 save barrier.

500 Home Runs - 25 members of the 500 club, and I think everyone will admit that it's not what it used to be after the steroid era. But it is still a fairly exclusive club, and with any luck we'll have someone respectable come out on top.

500 Stolen Bases - 37 players have reached 500 stolen bases in their career, and this is another of the categories where someone fairly one dimensional can get in, but I think it is one that is fun to watch.

3000 Hits - 28 members have reached the 3000 hit plateau during there careers and we will follow once someone gets 2000

1500 RBI / 1500 Runs - These were late additions to the milestone list, as 51 players have collected 1500 RBI, and 70 players have scored 1500 runs, but there is a lot of overlap from the other lists. Plus the inclusion will make more sense after I talk about the Hall of Fame.

In the end there were 160 players in one or more of the categories. Breaking it down by their debut decade below:

1870's - 13
1880's - 15
1890's - 7
1900's - 7
1910's - 5
1920's - 8
1930's - 4
1940's - 4
1950's - 15
1960's - 16
1970's - 22
1980's - 35
1990's - 9

[NYY #23]

And for my predictions:

HR: Ernie Banks
Hits: Ted Williams
SB: Rickie
W: Kid Nichols
K: Tom Seaver
S: Mo

[NYY #23]

I originally turned off automatic induction into the Hall of Fame, and was planning on manually inducting players who reached a milestone number, but that seemed too simplistic. I've always wanted to simulate a Hall of Fame vote, and tried it with an imperfect system once, which worked, but still had some problems. With the addition of WAR I started to modify my old system and get it working, but I stumbled upon this thread:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...me-voting.html

So thanks to hfield007 for coming up with the system, so I decided to do some testing with it, then created a spreadsheet and tried it out on some leagues, some players, and was very pleased with the results. I modified the optional requirements slightly by inserting in two categories (strikeouts and stolen bases) where I'm tracking milestones. I figure there is no point in tracking the milestones if they don't mean anything.

Win's - 300 (3 pts)
K's - 3000 (2 pts)
Saves - 300 (2 pts)
Hits - 3000 (3 pts)
Home Runs - 500 (3 pts)
Runs - 1500 ( 1 pt)
RBI -1500 (1 pt)
SB - 500 (1 pt)

So the Hall will be open much sooner than in real life. I'm thinking that 1900 will be the first election and I'll simulate a ballot with the players who are eligible, and the chosen few will be forever enshrined in the Milestone Hall of Fame.

[NYY #23]

With the start of baseball comes two players to follow from the beginning. Cap Anson, who holds 3 milestones with 3435 hits, 2075 RBI, and 1999 runs. Anson became the first member of the 3000 hit club on July 18, 1897, although his career hit total has always been controversial, as MLB didn't originally recognize his hit totals from the National Association. His hit totals range from 2995 to 3000 to 3081, the total recognized by the Hall of Fame. We'll give him a chance to start fresh though, and see if he can live up to his Hall of Fame plaque, which reads ""Greatest Hitter and Greatest National League Player-Manager of 19th Century"



The second player, Jim O'Rourke is benefitting from the addition of runs to the list. "Orator Jim" scored 1729 runs in a career that spanned 1872 to 1904. With 2643 hits in his career, it certainly wouldn't be too surprising if he made a run at 3000 hits as well. I should note that his final hit came in 1904 where he played one game for the Giants. Before that game O'Rourke last played in 1893.

Next debuts:
1. 1875 - Pud Galvin - 361 Wins
2. 1876 - Harry Stovey - 509 SB
3. 1877 - Monte Ward - 540 SB
4. 1877 - Dan Brouthers - 1523 R
5. 1878 - Old Hoss Radbourn - 309 Wins
6. 1878 - Mickey Welch - 307 Wins

[NYY #23]

Getting banned from baseball is a good way to ensure you don't reach any milestones, but lucky for George Hall he'll get a chance to play out his career and won't get the chance to throw any games.

Hall collected 538 hits before turning 29 before he was banned, playing through 1877. While that doesn't sound too impressive it's important to remember the number of games played each year, and as a point of reference Anson had 619 hits at the same point.

All that to say George Hall collected 63 hits which now makes him the career leader.

Lip Pike led the league with 7 homers, and 50 RBI, which Levi Meyerle scored 51 runs. George Wright led the league with 23 steals.

On the pitching side, Cherokee Fisher, Frank Fleet, and Dick McBride led the league in wins - each with 18. Asa Brainard struck out 37 to lead the league.

Player Watch
Cap Anson entered the league with the Cincinnati Reds after being drafted 11th in the inaugural draft. Jim O'Rourke didn't enter the league as planned. I checked and verified and he should have been in the inaugural draft pool, but wasn't. I created him manually and he is now a free agent, but I'll keep an eye on him and make sure he gets picked by a team before next season.

Hits
Cap Anson - 53

Runs
Cap Anson - 30
Jim O'Rourke - 0

RBI
Cap Anson - 30

[NYY #23]

Looking at both the single season and career leaders one name dominates the offensive categories leading over half the categories. Of course we are only in year 2, but Levi Meyerle is dominating the league at this point.

Meyerle became the first player to collect over 100 hits in a year this season, when he collected 105. In real life Meyerle hit .492 in 1871 and was a career .356 hitter in 7 seasons. Probably even more impressive (in a bad way), was his .646 fielding percentage at third base. A natural born DH, before the DH was established. He is always one guy that seems to stand out one way or another in the early leagues.

Meanwhile, Cap Anson had an even better second season, and sits just outside the top three in each of the three categories.

Career Leaders
Hits
1. Levi Meyerle - 163
2. Ross Barnes - 152
3. George hall - 146
Cap Anson - 132

Runs
1. Levi Meyerle - 117
2. Ross Barnes - 100
3. Charlie Smith - 98
Cap Anson - 88
Jim O'Rourke - 40

RBI
1. Ezra Sutton - 94
2. Lip Pike - 90
3. Gat Stires - 89
Cap Anson - 66

SB
1. Andy Leonard - 45
2. George Wright - 42
3. Ross Barnes - 35

Home Runs
1. Lip Pike - 8
2. Levi Meyerle - 5

Wins
1. Frank Fleet - 52
2. Dick McBride - 45
3. Al Pratt - 40

Strikeouts
1. Asa Brainard - 66
2. George Zettlein - 65
3. Al Pratt - 49

Saves
1. John McMullin - 5
2. Joe McDermott - 2
3. U McDoolan - 2

[NYY #23]

I've spent the first two seasons talking about batters, but for 1873 we'll turn our attention to pitchers, and talk about the career win leader, Dick McBride. With 75 wins after three seasons, McBride has increased his win total in each of the first three seasons, going from 18 to 28 to 29, and is now over halfway to his 149 career wins that he achieved in real life.

After a slow start to the season, Anson finished the season on a tear to add 66 hits to his total, and his 43 RBI were the most of his career. Jim O'Rourke didn't see much playing this time this year, and suffered a slight ratings hit, and managed to get in just 32 games.

Career Leaders
Hits
1. Levi Meyerle - 242
2. Ross Barnes - 237
3. George Hall - 231
4. Cal McVey - 224
5. Fred Waterman - 220
Cap Anson - 198

Runs
1. Levi Meyerle - 171
2. Ross Barnes - 166
3. George Wright - 157
4. Fred Waterman - 153
5. Charlie Smith - 152
Cap Anson - 133
Jim O'Rourke - 59

RBI
1. Ezra Sutton - 144
2. Cal McVey - 138
3. Lip Pike - 137
4. Ross Barnes - 132
5. Gat Stires - 128
Cap Anson - 109

SB
1. Andy Leonard - 75
2. Mike McGeary - 70
3. Fred Treacey - 63
4. George Wright - 63
5. Ross Barnes - 61

Home Runs
1. Lip Pike - 12
2. Levi Meyerle - 7
3. Gat Stires - 7
4. John Clapp - 6

Wins
1. Dick McBride - 75
2. Frank Fleet - 72
3. Al Pratt - 64
4. Cherokee Fisher - 62
5. Asa Brainard - 52
6. Bill Stearns - 52

Strikeouts
1. Asa Brainard - 110
2. George Zettlein - 92
3. Al Pratt - 70
4. Dick McBride - 69
5. Cherokee Fisher - 67

Saves
1. Jumbo McGinnis - 5
2. John McMullin - 5
3. Ryan Wolters - 4
4. U McDoolan - 4

[NYY #23]

It's seems I've played the early years quite a bit in one dynasty or another, but I don't ever recall the name of Billy Henry Taylor. But Taylor made a big first impression, winning 35 games during his rookie season with the Baltimore Orioles after being selected third overall in last year's amateur draft. At 19 years old Taylor appears like he could be worth watching if he can keep this pace up. Based on his ratings vs potential he has a lot of room for growth, and in real life Taylor made his debut in 1881, and his one good season came in 1884 when he won 43 games and lost 16. Just 15 more wins will match his career total. I'm going to shortlist Taylor, because the first 300 game winner may have just debuted.

Anson continued at a steady pace this year, hitting .341 and collecting a career high 94 hits moving up to the top 10 in the career list. O'Rourke is having a tough time in Baltimore, spending the majority of his time on the bench behind Davy Force. Just one year older, and performing better, Force may prevent O'Rourke from scoring the runs he needs, barring a trade.

Career Leaders
Hits
1. Ross Barnes - 345
2. Levi Meyerle - 336
3. George Hall - 334
4. Fred Waterman - 329
5. Cal McVey - 310
Cap Anson - 292

Runs
1. Ross Barnes - 228
2. Levi Meyerle - 224
3. George Hall - 217
4. Cal McVey - 210
5. Fred Waterman - 210
Cap Anson - 198
Jim O'Rourke - 77

RBI
1. Lip Pike - 186
2. Dick Higham - 184
3. Cal McVey - 184
4. Ezra Sutton - 179
5. Ross Barnes - 173
Cap Anson - 166

SB
1. Andy Leonard - 106
2. Mike McGeary - 106
3. Fred Treacey - 97
4. Ross Barnes - 88
5. George Wright - 83

Home Runs
1. Lip Pike - 13
2. Levi Meyerle - 9
3. John Clapp - 8
4. Charlie Hodes - 8
5. Gat Stires - 8

Wins
1. Dick McBride - 108
2. Asa Brainard - 79
3. Frank Fleet - 78
4. Al Pratt - 78
5. Cherokee Fisher - 77
6. Bill Stearns - 66

Strikeouts
1. Asa Brainard - 170
2. Jim Britt - 111
3. George Zettlein - 106
4. Dick McBride - 101
5. Al Pratt - 93
6. Cherokee Fisher - 78

Saves
1. Jumbo McGinnis - 5
2. John McMullin - 5
3. Ryan Wolters - 4
4. U McDoolan - 4

[NYY #23]

Pud Galvin is the next player set to make his debut in the 1875 season. Galvin won 365 games in his big league career, to go with a 2.85 ERA and 1807 strikeouts. Galvin was the first member of the 300 win club, collecting his 300th win on September 4, 1888 for the Pittsburgh Alleghenys.

Galvin is the only pitcher in baseball history to win 20 or more games in 10 different years without winning the pennant. Nicknamed "The Little Steam Engine" Galvin accumulated 6003 innings and 646 complete games, both second to only Cy Young. Galvin was also the first pitcher to throw a no-hitter on the road.


I've honestly never remember seeing Galvin have much success in any league I've done, but perhaps this will be the first time.

[scott1964]

Originally Posted by NYY #23

I've honestly never remember seeing Galvin have much success in any league I've done, but perhaps this will be the first time.

Pud did not do very good in my dynasty either. He played for 20 years, 1875 to 1895 and won only 112 games (112-159, 2.80 era). Only 2 seasons did he win over 20 games, 1876 with Boston (25-30, 2.71) and 1882 with Chicago White Sox/Stockings (20-16, 2.88)

[NYY #23]

Originally Posted by scott1964

Pud did not do very good in my dynasty either. He played for 20 years, 1875 to 1895 and won only 112 games (112-159, 2.80 era). Only 2 seasons did he win over 20 games, 1876 with Boston (25-30, 2.71) and 1882 with Chicago White Sox/Stockings (20-16, 2.88)

I don't even remember him doing that well, but I'd be real surprised if he comes close to 300 wins.

[NYY #23]

After winning the Hitter of the Year Award this season, Ross Barnes seems to have cemented his place as best offense player in the league, pushing his career batting average to .376, and leading the league in hits and runs. Barnes was one of the early stars of the National Association in real life and the National League. He led the league in both hits and runs four times, and batting average three times so his success isn't too big of a surprise. With a career shortened by illness, Barnes quickly fell from grace and retired at the age of 31 after several unproductive seasons. We'll see if Barnes can continue his success and earn a place in history.

Anson had an interesting season, seeing a ratings improvement, but having by far the worst season of his career hitting .253. O'Rourke also had a career worst .222 average. Luckily Billy Henry Taylor continued his success, winning 29 games for the offensively challenged Orioles.

Galvin was drafted as the first overall pick in the amateur draft by the St. Louis Brown Stockings, and pitched 45 innings out of the bullpen.

Career Leaders
Hits
1. Ross Barnes - 438
2. George Hall - 426
3. Levi Meyerle - 421
4. Fred Waterman - 394
5. Cal McVey - 390
Cap Anson - 357

Runs
1. Ross Barnes - 284
2. Levi Meyerle - 279
3. George Hall - 276
4. Charlie Smith - 274
5. Andy Leonard - 259
Cap Anson - 229
Jim O'Rourke - 85

RBI
1. Cal McVey - 246
2. Ezra Sutton - 233
3. Dick Higham - 228
4. Lip Pike - 226
5. Ross Barnes - 217
Cap Anson - 201

SB
1. Andy Leonard - 139
2. Mike McGeary - 137
3. Ross Barnes - 115
4. Fred Treacey - 106
5. George Wright - 102

Home Runs
1. Lip Pike - 15
2. Levi Meyerle - 11
3. Charlie Hodes - 10
4. John Bass - 9
5. John Clapp - 9

Wins
1. Dick McBride - 143
2. Asa Brainard - 113
3. Jim Britt - 83
4. Frank Fleet - 80
5. Al Pratt - 80
6. Cherokee Fisher - 78
7. Bill Stearns - 76
8. Billy Henry Taylor - 64
Pud Galvin - 0

Strikeouts
1. Asa Brainard - 237
2. Jim Britt - 200
3. Dick McBride - 139
4. Jumbo McGinnis - 113
5. George Zettlein - 112
6. Billy Henry Taylor - 107
7. Al Pratt - 102
8. Bill Stearns - 98
9. Cherokee Fisher - 80

Saves
1. Jake Seymour - 7
2. Hugh O'Neill - 6
3. Jumbo McGinnis - 5
4. John McMullin - 5

[NYY #23]

The first member of the 500 stolen base club is set to make their debut in 1876, Harry Stovey. Stovey hit .295 for his career, and drove in 908 runs while collecting 509 stolen bases. Stovey was also known as one of the best home run hitters of the day, hitting 122 for his career. Stovey set season records with 14 home runs and 97 stolen bases.

[ImTheCrew]

Nice

[NYY #23]

I better use this time to call out the exploits of 35 year old Asa Brainard before it is too late, as he is 10 wins short of becoming the second 150 game winner. Brainard has been a steady force for the Cleveland Blues, winning 25 games for the fourth straight season, but looks to have begin the downward cycle of his career after a 27-28 season. Either way it has been an impressive run for someone who went 5-22 in real life.



Harry Stovey was the fourth overall pick in the draft, and made his debut this season with the Brooklyn Atlantics. His 21 steals this season ranked fourth in the league. It looks like Jim O'Rourke will be the first bust after only getting 4 at-bats this season.

Career Leaders
Hits
1. Ross Barnes - 513
2. George Hall - 506
3. Levi Meyerle - 497
4. Cal McVey - 479
5. Fred Waterman - 467
Cap Anson - 432

Runs
1. Ross Barnes - 329
2. George Hall - 312
3. Levi Meyerle - 311
4. Charlie Smith - 306
5. Andy Leonard - 304
Cap Anson - 262
Jim O'Rourke - 85

RBI
1. Cal McVey - 292
2. Lip Pike - 279
3. Dick Higham - 252
4. Ezra Sutton - 251
5. Ross Barnes - 248
Cap Anson - 230

SB
1. Mike McGeary - 163
2. Andy Leonard - 159
3. Ross Barnes - 139
4. George Wright - 125
5. Dave Eggler - 119
6. Fred Treacey - 110
Harry Stovey - 21

Home Runs
1. Lip Pike - 20
2. Charlie Hodes - 12
3. Levi Meyerle - 12
4. John Bass - 10
5. John Clapp - 10

Wins
1. Dick McBride - 173
2. Asa Brainard - 140
3. Jim Britt - 103
4. Billy Henry Taylor - 95
5. Frank Fleet - 82
6. Al Pratt - 82
7. Cherokee Fisher - 80
8. Bill Stearns - 76
Pud Galvin - 0

Strikeouts
1. Asa Brainard - 287
2. Jim Britt - 281
3. Dick McBride - 185
4. Billy Henry Taylor - 182
5. George Zettlein - 165
6. Jumbo McGinnis - 119
7. Al Pratt - 109
8. Bill Stearns - 98
9. Tommy Bond - 83
10. Frank Fleet - 83

Saves
1. Jake Seymour - 9
2. Hugh O'Neill - 7
3. Jumbo McGinnis - 5
4. John McMullin - 5