Anyone noticed lately?

David Watts · 08-24-2013, 01:37 PM

Just how stinking great this game has become when it comes to historical play. I'm in the 19th year of a random debut league and I'm blown away at how realistic players careers are turning out. WOW!

Peregrine · 08-24-2013, 01:44 PM

I'm in the late '60s in my historical league - using real teams and players but the players are drafted, not on their historical teams. Really interesting to see how things turned out - Babe Ruth is the best pitcher in the history of the game, but Willie Mays turned into an injury-prone utility outfielder after a couple promising seasons.

David Watts · 08-24-2013, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine

I'm in the late '60s in my historical league - using real teams and players but the players are drafted, not on their historical teams. Really interesting to see how things turned out - Babe Ruth is the best pitcher in the history of the game, but Willie Mays turned into an injury-prone utility outfielder after a couple promising seasons.

Mantle in my league is going to have a nice career, but injuries have really hampered him as well. He's the only guy to hit .400 (406) in my league, but he was only able to suit up for 125 games that year. .406 with an amazing .524 obp. He also owns the single season home run record hitting 53.

VanillaGorilla · 08-24-2013, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Just how stinking great this game has become when it comes to historical play. I'm in the 19th year of a random debut league and I'm blown away at how realistic players careers are turning out. WOW!

Welcome to my Nightmare

Ok, perhaps referencing my own Alice Cooper reference in another thread is substandard form, but you are the one who started me on that track, so I plea diminished responsibility.

Anyway, glad you are liking it, too. What settings are you using for injury and fatigue?

David Watts · 08-24-2013, 03:59 PM

I would also like to say thanks to Mr VanillaGorilla. For years the going advice was, turn off player development when playing historical. But, along comes this cat and he says leave development on. I love it. Plus, he's taken the time to answer a lot of my dumb questions about random debut. Random debut was the main reason I purchased 13. It took me a couple months into 14 to get the hang of it. Damn, I wish I had the his game when I was a kid. I bet my mom does too. I remember her telling me that when she sold the house and was packing to move, the amount of paper, notebook, scoresheets etc. she tossed out would have filled an entire uhaul.

Oh I was typing when VG showed up. :

David Watts · 08-24-2013, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla

Welcome to my Nightmare

Ok, perhaps referencing my own Alice Cooper reference in another thread is substandard form, but you are the one who started me on that track, so I plea diminished responsibility.

Anyway, glad you are liking it, too. What settings are you using for injury and fatigue?

I'm using normal for injuries and average for fatigue. I've actually been debating upping the fatigue. I think I will keep injuries at normal this time around.

endgame · 08-24-2013, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Oh I was typing when VG showed up. :

Oh yeah, he'll do that when the rump pats are going around.

Oh, and the brawls. Ha!

actionjackson · 08-24-2013, 04:25 PM

@David: Do you play with recalc on, or just turn on the development engine and let 'er rip?

David Watts · 08-24-2013, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionjackson

@David: Do you play with recalc on, or just turn on the development engine and let 'er rip?

I'm using recalc , 3 year. Finding that 3 year allows enough of a cushion that I'm not having guys be the ace of the staff one year and drop to the 4th or 5th starter the next year. May try 5 year one of these days. I tried and tried to do random debut with recalc off, but could never get the results I wanted. I like development combined with recalc especially for players that play past their actual retirement age or in the case of random debut, past their current age. Oh and I'm using real stat over neutered.

VanillaGorilla · 08-24-2013, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endgame

Oh yeah, he'll do that when the rump pats are going around.

Oh, and the brawls. Ha!

Hungry?

.. . ...

akw4572 · 08-24-2013, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

I'm using recalc , 3 year. Finding that 3 year allows enough of a cushion that I'm not having guys be the ace of the staff one year and drop to the 4th or 5th starter the next year. May try 5 year one of these days. I tried and tried to do random debut with recalc off, but could never get the results I wanted. I like development combined with recalc especially for players that play past their actual retirement age or in the case of random debut, past their current age. Oh and I'm using real stat over neutered.

His do you work the draft and minor leagues with that set up? Just trying to wrap my brain around how to set it up. With the random debut and recalc, do players play the same number of seasons they do in real life, then retire?

David Watts · 08-25-2013, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akw4572

His do you work the draft and minor leagues with that set up? Just trying to wrap my brain around how to set it up. With the random debut and recalc, do players play the same number of seasons they do in real life, then retire?

I have the game import enough players for a 5 round draft each season. I don't use minor leagues though, I simply have reserve rosters. For this league I've been using the reserve clause instead of free agency. As for players playing the same number of seasons, that's the beauty of leaving player development on. Players can play well beyond their actual play years, but the development engine kicks in . Of course, a lot of players careers do end close to when they did in real life, as their skills have diminished, thus the reason they were no longer playing in reality. That's one of the things I'm finding so amazing about this game.

Next thing I hope OOTP adopts or develops... the ability of the AI to see the future when using recalc .

akw4572 · 08-25-2013, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

I have the game import enough players for a 5 round draft each season. I don't use minor leagues though, I simply have reserve rosters. For this league I've been using the reserve clause instead of free agency. As for players playing the same number of seasons, that's the beauty of leaving player development on. Players can play well beyond their actual play years, but the development engine kicks in . Of course, a lot of players careers do end close to when they did in real life, as their skills have diminished, thus the reason they were no longer playing in reality. That's one of the things I'm finding so amazing about this game.

Next thing I hope OOTP adopts or develops... the ability of the AI to see the future when using recalc .

Awesome. Thanks man. I'm going to give this a shot. My solo play was getting stale.

nyy26wc · 08-25-2013, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Next thing I hope OOTP adopts or develops... the ability of the AI to see the future when using recalc .

Can you explain what you mean by that?

RchW · 08-25-2013, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nyy26wc

Can you explain what you mean by that?

Trading?

akw4572 · 08-25-2013, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nyy26wc

Can you explain what you mean by that?

I would imagine he means a team would take into consideration, and give appropriate weight to, the "future" of say Babe Ruth before trading him as a 25 year old.

RonP · 08-25-2013, 11:00 AM

I was never able to get a full season out of Mantle. He not only would get hurt early he would get hurt again when he came back. I read something about resetting the injury numbers for that type of player and I'm thinking about it.
P.S. If that is your picture up there, David you look a little like, Phil Jackson.

David Watts · 08-25-2013, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nyy26wc

Can you explain what you mean by that?

RchW nailed it. I think it would be cool if the AI had at least an inkling what it was trading for and away. Would help assure that one or 2 year wonders don't get traded for a stud. Overall the trade AI is pretty solid though.

David Watts · 08-25-2013, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonP

I was never able to get a full season out of Mantle. He not only would get hurt early he would get hurt again when he came back. I read something about resetting the injury numbers for that type of player and I'm thinking about it.
P.S. If that is your picture up there, David you look a little like, Phil Jackson.

Not a pic of me. That's a picture of Elmore Leonard, one of my all time favorite authors. He passed away this past week. I never thought of the Phil Jackson angle. We were thinking that if Elmore is what Warren Zevon would have looked like as an old man

VanillaGorilla · 08-25-2013, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Next thing I hope OOTP adopts or develops... the ability of the AI to see the future when using recalc .

I think this is alleviated by using player development with the recalc, since the AI is going on the projected development curve for its potential ratings.

In my current league, I fell prey to the early release bug which had all parks in new historical leagues rated as neutral. I had already begun playing and decided to simply roll with it and see what I would see. It has become clear, to me, that the base performance from RL that is used for recalc is important, but not the end all, as to how a player performs.

I also think that using "neutered" stats alleviates this even further in so much as it makes the raw numbers from RL less meaningful to the eye. If you are using raw numbers, then you know Larry Doyle will never hit 484 HR. However, playing in a 21st Century environment, he did that in my league. The neutralized stats make his skill projection relative to his alternate reality contemporaries more meaningful than the raw numbers from RL.

I describe recalc and player development as "meshing" together to provide a neat alternative reality. I don't see them as conflicting, nor do I see their relationship as one where the former takes precedence over the latter re player career curves.

This is just one user's opinion from one user's experience. I do not present this as Gospel.

08-24-2013, 01:37 PM	#1
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,489 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Anyone noticed lately? Just how stinking great this game has become when it comes to historical play. I'm in the 19th year of a random debut league and I'm blown away at how realistic players careers are turning out. WOW!

08-24-2013, 03:59 PM	#5
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,489 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	I would also like to say thanks to Mr VanillaGorilla. For years the going advice was, turn off player development when playing historical. But, along comes this cat and he says leave development on. I love it. Plus, he's taken the time to answer a lot of my dumb questions about random debut. Random debut was the main reason I purchased 13. It took me a couple months into 14 to get the hang of it. Damn, I wish I had the his game when I was a kid. I bet my mom does too. I remember her telling me that when she sold the house and was packing to move, the amount of paper, notebook, scoresheets etc. she tossed out would have filled an entire uhaul. Oh I was typing when VG showed up. : Last edited by David Watts; 08-24-2013 at 04:05 PM.

08-25-2013, 11:00 AM	#17
RonP Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 226	I was never able to get a full season out of Mantle. He not only would get hurt early he would get hurt again when he came back. I read something about resetting the injury numbers for that type of player and I'm thinking about it. P.S. If that is your picture up there, David you look a little like, Phil Jackson. Last edited by RonP; 08-25-2013 at 11:04 AM.

08-24-2013, 01:44 PM	#2
Peregrine All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Cary, North Carolina Posts: 635	I'm in the late '60s in my historical league - using real teams and players but the players are drafted, not on their historical teams. Really interesting to see how things turned out - Babe Ruth is the best pitcher in the history of the game, but Willie Mays turned into an injury-prone utility outfielder after a couple promising seasons.

08-24-2013, 04:25 PM	#8
actionjackson Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 6,163	@David: Do you play with recalc on, or just turn on the development engine and let 'er rip?