Give us an option to disable fielding experience

austin101123 · 11-27-2020, 07:15 AM

In sims, like a likelong CF on CPU teams may get 45/70/70 ratings with age and be posting -40 ZR in CF or playing DH and never moves to RF or LF instead. Or a SS gets 50 range and never moves to 2B or 3B, or an infielder or outfielder ever moving to 1B.

I also see guys who start playing one position like 1B or LF, and never play like 3B or 2B or something they would be better off yet because they never got the experience there.

Largely unrealistic, definitely annoying. Easily fixable with not much downsides when you would turn it off. Guys usually learn to be pretty decent at a position during ST and offseason IRL between seasons. And within a year or two usually are the best they'll be.

CBeisbol · 11-27-2020, 12:55 PM

I don't know about disabling fielding experience, but I certainly agree that the AI not moving players to other positions is a problem

BirdWatcher · 11-29-2020, 11:07 AM

This is an interesting topic to me and I will be looking more closely at my fictional league today with an eye towards this sort of thing.

My initial feeling is that I do see players on the AI managed teams in my league transition as they age from more challenging positions to less challenging ones in ways that seem to mirror real life quite well. (Thinking about center fielders who have transitioned to corner outfield positions and third baseman who have transitioned to first base and corner outfielders who have transitioned to first base. There is no DH in my league.) But certainly I've also seen players stay at their original position far longer than I would have kept them there, beyond a time when they had defensive value at those positions. I'll look more closely at my league, as I said, to see what the balance between these approaches looks like.

I would say though that I think it would be wrong if the AI always made the logical decision on these matters, if players always transitioned positions based upon logic alone. Because, in my experience, players are kept at positions in real life that they probably shouldn't logically be playing all the time. Sometimes this is because the team just doesn't see any great alternatives, sometimes it is just the entropy that sets in with the way a team sees an aging star player. ("Okay, the metrics guys tell us his defensive stats have declined, but he still looks pretty good to us, there is probably something wrong with the numbers, and hey, he won a Gold Glove out there 6 years ago, he can't be that bad, right. Besides, you want to be the one to tell him he's not a center fielder anymore?") As a Rockies fan, the example I immediately think of is how much longer Charlie Blackmon stayed in center field than he probably should have.

So while it is always good for the AI to be improved to make better decisions, I would never want it to make such logical, flawless decisions that it no longer actually was any good at all at mirroring how real life human decisions are made, how often they are not logical, how often they are flawed.

Brad K · 11-29-2020, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BirdWatcher

So while it is always good for the AI to be improved to make better decisions, I would never want it to make such logical, flawless decisions that it no longer actually was any good at all at mirroring how real life human decisions are made, how often they are not logical, how often they are flawed.

AI for different teams should not have the same ability.

BirdWatcher · 11-30-2020, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

AI for different teams should not have the same ability.

Sorry, I'm not sure I understand what you are saying.

Are you saying that the AI for some teams should make better decisions than the AI for other teams? If so, then I completely agree. (I also guess I'm assuming that this is already in the game, that teams with better front office/management/scouting staff make better decisions than teams with inferior management leadership.)

austin101123 · 03-05-2021, 08:27 PM

Here's some examples from a league real quick.

That SS posting -20 ZRs every year should've/could've just moved over to 2B and been alright.

https://imgur.com/a/W6nUs5Q

austin101123 · 03-05-2021, 08:31 PM

A lot of people in this league with no DH are just pinch hit bats instead of learning 1B like a lot of them could, like that 2B in the image linked above.

11-27-2020, 07:15 AM	#1
austin101123 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 36	Give us an option to disable fielding experience In sims, like a likelong CF on CPU teams may get 45/70/70 ratings with age and be posting -40 ZR in CF or playing DH and never moves to RF or LF instead. Or a SS gets 50 range and never moves to 2B or 3B, or an infielder or outfielder ever moving to 1B. I also see guys who start playing one position like 1B or LF, and never play like 3B or 2B or something they would be better off yet because they never got the experience there. Largely unrealistic, definitely annoying. Easily fixable with not much downsides when you would turn it off. Guys usually learn to be pretty decent at a position during ST and offseason IRL between seasons. And within a year or two usually are the best they'll be.

11-29-2020, 11:07 AM	#3
BirdWatcher Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 4,263	This is an interesting topic to me and I will be looking more closely at my fictional league today with an eye towards this sort of thing. My initial feeling is that I do see players on the AI managed teams in my league transition as they age from more challenging positions to less challenging ones in ways that seem to mirror real life quite well. (Thinking about center fielders who have transitioned to corner outfield positions and third baseman who have transitioned to first base and corner outfielders who have transitioned to first base. There is no DH in my league.) But certainly I've also seen players stay at their original position far longer than I would have kept them there, beyond a time when they had defensive value at those positions. I'll look more closely at my league, as I said, to see what the balance between these approaches looks like. I would say though that I think it would be wrong if the AI always made the logical decision on these matters, if players always transitioned positions based upon logic alone. Because, in my experience, players are kept at positions in real life that they probably shouldn't logically be playing all the time. Sometimes this is because the team just doesn't see any great alternatives, sometimes it is just the entropy that sets in with the way a team sees an aging star player. ("Okay, the metrics guys tell us his defensive stats have declined, but he still looks pretty good to us, there is probably something wrong with the numbers, and hey, he won a Gold Glove out there 6 years ago, he can't be that bad, right. Besides, you want to be the one to tell him he's not a center fielder anymore?") As a Rockies fan, the example I immediately think of is how much longer Charlie Blackmon stayed in center field than he probably should have. So while it is always good for the AI to be improved to make better decisions, I would never want it to make such logical, flawless decisions that it no longer actually was any good at all at mirroring how real life human decisions are made, how often they are not logical, how often they are flawed. __________________ The Denver Brewers of the W.P. Kinsella League-- The fun starts here(1965-1971: https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...d.php?t=289570 And continues here (1972-1976): https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...d.php?t=300500 On we go (1977- 1979): https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...d.php?t=314601 For ongoing and more random updates on the WPK:https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...d.php?t=325147, https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...d.php?t=330717

11-27-2020, 12:55 PM	#2
CBeisbol Banned Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: Ban land in 3...2... Posts: 2,943	I don't know about disabling fielding experience, but I certainly agree that the AI not moving players to other positions is a problem

03-05-2021, 08:27 PM	#6
austin101123 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 36	Here's some examples from a league real quick. That SS posting -20 ZRs every year should've/could've just moved over to 2B and been alright. https://imgur.com/a/W6nUs5Q

03-05-2021, 08:31 PM	#7
austin101123 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 36	A lot of people in this league with no DH are just pinch hit bats instead of learning 1B like a lot of them could, like that 2B in the image linked above.