Hook for Starting/Relief Pitcher

rdomico · 04-02-2023, 10:26 AM

Assume I created a fictional league using 1988 as my year I am basing my stats on. So I do that. I put lock league totals on and Auto-Calculate on.

I start my league in 1988. My first season is great. The stats look really close to what I want which is 1988. I quick play a bunch of years and I notice almost everything looks good. The thing that I see that is off is Complete Games. They have fallen off to look like modern baseball. I look at my league settings and I notice that Hook For Starting Pitcher is now -5 and Hook for Relief Pitcher is -5.

Why are those hook ratings under General Strategic Tendencies changing? Those are tendencies. They should remain the same. Is there some setting I am missing? Is that a bug? My modifiers change. That makes sense because I have autocalc on. I don't think tendencies should change because of autocalc. If they are supposed to change, they are changing to incorrect values.

I do not have Automatically Adjust League Strategy Settings When Advancing to Next Season checked. I would think that would be the thing that controls that.

Thanks

Rain King · 04-02-2023, 11:09 AM

This is a good question.

I am also curious as to what goes into determining that setting. They definitely change when auto-calc runs, but I've never seen an explanation as to what is being factored into that.

My theory has been that it is taking bullpen depth around the league into account and essentially adjusting those settings so that teams are more efficient as far as when to pull pitchers, but I agree that isn't always what we want auto-calc to do.

In fact, I'm somewhat the opposite. If I am correct in how those settings are being calculated, I would like a way for those to auto-calculate WITHOUT needing to run auto-calc. I want the league stat modifiers to stay the same year-to-year (to get natural fluctuation), but the game to be able to adjust regarding the pull settings.

tonnage · 04-02-2023, 11:20 AM

I noticed that in 24 there's a "Use pre-calculated modifiers for accuracy" button you can check. This wasn't in 23, so I'm wondering if that might need to be checked? Actually, I'm wondering what that does when checked?

rdomico · 04-02-2023, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonnage

I noticed that in 24 there's a "Use pre-calculated modifiers for accuracy" button you can check. This wasn't in 23, so I'm wondering if that might need to be checked? Actually, I'm wondering what that does when checked?

I noticed that too. I am not sure what it is for. It isn't in the manual.

PSUColonel · 04-02-2023, 04:35 PM

This has me intrigued also..I have been using it for the world setup I am constructing. I am hoping this is why you can now "set it and forget it" when it comes to auto-calc modifiers.

In another thread people were telling me that there was no way I could just set it and forget it, but this feature may be a new reason why the developers told me I could.

EDIT: I think the exact setting you are referring to is called "Use Auto-Calc of modifiers for accuracy (Recommended)". This seems to automatically adjust the general strategic tendencies along with the league totals/frequency modifiers. If this is what I hope it is...it's a godsend. Also...if it does what I hope it does...something similar could be used for finances I'd think.

tonnage · 04-02-2023, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

EDIT: I think the exact setting you are referring to is called "Use Auto-Calc of modifiers for accuracy (Recommended)". This seems to automatically adjust the general strategic tendencies along with the league totals/frequency modifiers. If this is what I hope it is...it's a godsend. Also...if it does what I hope it does...something similar could be used for finances I'd think.

Nope, it is called "Use pre-calculated modifiers for accuracy" and it's right above "Use Auto-Calc of modifiers for accuracy (Recommended)". I'd like to know what "Use pre-calculated modifiers for accuracy" does?

PSUColonel · 04-02-2023, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rain King

This is a good question.

I am also curious as to what goes into determining that setting. They definitely change when auto-calc runs, but I've never seen an explanation as to what is being factored into that.

My theory has been that it is taking bullpen depth around the league into account and essentially adjusting those settings so that teams are more efficient as far as when to pull pitchers, but I agree that isn't always what we want auto-calc to do.

In fact, I'm somewhat the opposite. If I am correct in how those settings are being calculated, I would like a way for those to auto-calculate WITHOUT needing to run auto-calc. I want the league stat modifiers to stay the same year-to-year (to get natural fluctuation), but the game to be able to adjust regarding the pull settings.

The strange thing is this though...when you hit auto-calc it changes...if you hit it again, it changes to something very different, and so forth until you do it about 3 or 4 times. I don't get it. This is also with the new setting checked BTW.

rdomico · 04-02-2023, 08:09 PM

Auto-Recalc causes the numbers to change each time you hit it because it is actually running simulations to figure out those numbers. So there is some variance each time. That is working correctly. My issue is it also changes the hook settings. Either it shouldn't change them or it is changing them incorrectly.

PSUColonel · 04-02-2023, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdomico

Auto-Recalc causes the numbers to change each time you hit it because it is actually running simulations to figure out those numbers. So there is some variance each time. That is working correctly. My issue is it also changes the hook settings. Either it shouldn't change them or it is changing them incorrectly.

yes, this is what I was referring to. The hook settings can change quite a bit at times in terms of variance.

PSUColonel · 04-03-2023, 12:13 AM

One thing that could be going on is that when the auto-calc is hit, sometimes it is on the fringe of either a pitcher stamina or hook....so sometimes it might go with lower stamina and a slower hook, or another time it could go with higher stamina and a quicker hook.

rdomico · 04-03-2023, 12:05 PM

I think the bug is hook is tied to the year. So it makes sense to vary slightly based on the players in the league, but the issue is something else. If I want my league to be based on 1988 stats, the hook testing should recalc based on that, but it is based off the year in the game. So if you start a league in 1988, it works for that year. But then you play until 2020 it recalcs hook based on 2020 stats even if you locked your league totals to 1988.

rdomico · 04-03-2023, 12:06 PM

And it would be nice if someone from the development team could chime in.

koohead · 04-03-2023, 12:14 PM

FWIW the behavior was the same in 23

Mat · 04-03-2023, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdomico

I think the bug is hook is tied to the year. So it makes sense to vary slightly based on the players in the league, but the issue is something else. If I want my league to be based on 1988 stats, the hook testing should recalc based on that, but it is based off the year in the game. So if you start a league in 1988, it works for that year. But then you play until 2020 it recalcs hook based on 2020 stats even if you locked your league totals to 1988.

I think this is the problem.

atlbrave1 · 04-03-2023, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mat

I think this is the problem.

Agree. Try using the same totals and modifiers but have your league start in 2023. I don't think those settings will be overwritten going forward. At least they don't in a similar setup I have used for years, but I always start the league in the current year not a past one.

rdomico · 04-03-2023, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atlbrave1

Agree. Try using the same totals and modifiers but have your league start in 2023. I don't think those settings will be overwritten going forward. At least they don't in a similar setup I have used for years, but I always start the league in the current year not a past one.

If I start with 2023, you get the same problem. When you do a recalc, it changes the hook setting based on 2023. I even tried manually setting it in 2023, but then in 2024, it gets changed back to modern settings. So I could solve the problem by manually setting it every year, but I wish the game did it correctly.

Basically, for 1988, the hook setting should probably be +1 or +2. It gets set to around -2 after a recalc for 2023 and the future.

rdomico · 04-03-2023, 02:23 PM

I guess I will file a bug. I hope it has a better chance to be seen in that forum

atlbrave1 · 04-03-2023, 05:25 PM

Had to double check on my setup. Below is a screenshot. I did not check any of the boxes at creation, just have modifiers and my own league totals. Hook or other settings have not changed over time since league creation (start dated of 2023). Hop this helps.

rdomico · 04-03-2023, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atlbrave1

Had to double check on my setup. Below is a screenshot. I did not check any of the boxes at creation, just have modifiers and my own league totals. Hook or other settings have not changed over time since league creation (start dated of 2023). Hop this helps.

You don't have auto calc on

atlbrave1 · 04-03-2023, 09:10 PM

I see what you want to do. Yep, you are correct, probably a bug. See screenshots below - hook value changes in 2nd year (start year of 2023). I still would recommend trying to set up without using the auto-calc feature. Autocalc under calculates errors and stolen base attempts by a large margin so you might want to look at just using modifiers rather than autocalc.

04-02-2023, 10:26 AM	#1
rdomico All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Monaca, PA Posts: 828	Hook for Starting/Relief Pitcher Assume I created a fictional league using 1988 as my year I am basing my stats on. So I do that. I put lock league totals on and Auto-Calculate on. I start my league in 1988. My first season is great. The stats look really close to what I want which is 1988. I quick play a bunch of years and I notice almost everything looks good. The thing that I see that is off is Complete Games. They have fallen off to look like modern baseball. I look at my league settings and I notice that Hook For Starting Pitcher is now -5 and Hook for Relief Pitcher is -5. Why are those hook ratings under General Strategic Tendencies changing? Those are tendencies. They should remain the same. Is there some setting I am missing? Is that a bug? My modifiers change. That makes sense because I have autocalc on. I don't think tendencies should change because of autocalc. If they are supposed to change, they are changing to incorrect values. I do not have Automatically Adjust League Strategy Settings When Advancing to Next Season checked. I would think that would be the thing that controls that. Thanks

04-02-2023, 11:09 AM	#2
Rain King Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 3,072 Infractions: 1/1 (1)	This is a good question. I am also curious as to what goes into determining that setting. They definitely change when auto-calc runs, but I've never seen an explanation as to what is being factored into that. My theory has been that it is taking bullpen depth around the league into account and essentially adjusting those settings so that teams are more efficient as far as when to pull pitchers, but I agree that isn't always what we want auto-calc to do. In fact, I'm somewhat the opposite. If I am correct in how those settings are being calculated, I would like a way for those to auto-calculate WITHOUT needing to run auto-calc. I want the league stat modifiers to stay the same year-to-year (to get natural fluctuation), but the game to be able to adjust regarding the pull settings. Last edited by Rain King; 04-02-2023 at 11:11 AM.

04-02-2023, 04:35 PM	#5
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,094	This has me intrigued also..I have been using it for the world setup I am constructing. I am hoping this is why you can now "set it and forget it" when it comes to auto-calc modifiers. In another thread people were telling me that there was no way I could just set it and forget it, but this feature may be a new reason why the developers told me I could. EDIT: I think the exact setting you are referring to is called "Use Auto-Calc of modifiers for accuracy (Recommended)". This seems to automatically adjust the general strategic tendencies along with the league totals/frequency modifiers. If this is what I hope it is...it's a godsend. Also...if it does what I hope it does...something similar could be used for finances I'd think. Last edited by PSUColonel; 04-02-2023 at 06:25 PM.

04-03-2023, 12:14 PM	#13
koohead Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 3,196	FWIW the behavior was the same in 23 __________________ GM - New Jersey Bears of the NPBL;

04-03-2023, 05:25 PM	#18
atlbrave1 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 277	Had to double check on my setup. Below is a screenshot. I did not check any of the boxes at creation, just have modifiers and my own league totals. Hook or other settings have not changed over time since league creation (start dated of 2023). Hop this helps. Attached Images

04-02-2023, 11:20 AM	#3
tonnage Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2020 Location: Stony Plain, Alberta Posts: 490	I noticed that in 24 there's a "Use pre-calculated modifiers for accuracy" button you can check. This wasn't in 23, so I'm wondering if that might need to be checked? Actually, I'm wondering what that does when checked?

04-02-2023, 08:09 PM	#8
rdomico All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Monaca, PA Posts: 828	Auto-Recalc causes the numbers to change each time you hit it because it is actually running simulations to figure out those numbers. So there is some variance each time. That is working correctly. My issue is it also changes the hook settings. Either it shouldn't change them or it is changing them incorrectly.

04-03-2023, 12:13 AM	#10
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,094	One thing that could be going on is that when the auto-calc is hit, sometimes it is on the fringe of either a pitcher stamina or hook....so sometimes it might go with lower stamina and a slower hook, or another time it could go with higher stamina and a quicker hook.

04-03-2023, 12:05 PM	#11
rdomico All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Monaca, PA Posts: 828	I think the bug is hook is tied to the year. So it makes sense to vary slightly based on the players in the league, but the issue is something else. If I want my league to be based on 1988 stats, the hook testing should recalc based on that, but it is based off the year in the game. So if you start a league in 1988, it works for that year. But then you play until 2020 it recalcs hook based on 2020 stats even if you locked your league totals to 1988.

04-03-2023, 12:06 PM	#12
rdomico All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Monaca, PA Posts: 828	And it would be nice if someone from the development team could chime in.

04-03-2023, 02:23 PM	#17
rdomico All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Monaca, PA Posts: 828	I guess I will file a bug. I hope it has a better chance to be seen in that forum

04-03-2023, 09:10 PM	#20
atlbrave1 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 277	I see what you want to do. Yep, you are correct, probably a bug. See screenshots below - hook value changes in 2nd year (start year of 2023). I still would recommend trying to set up without using the auto-calc feature. Autocalc under calculates errors and stolen base attempts by a large margin so you might want to look at just using modifiers rather than autocalc. Attached Images