Relief pitcher wanting over 40mil per year!

[Dfost35]

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...1&d=1745351890

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...1&d=1745351890


Is this normal in 26?!

[Bagpipes5]

Sadly in my experiences so far, yes. Edwin Diaz is the highest paid this year at $20.4 mil. This is more than double what the highest paid guy is making. Hopefully there will be a balance pass in the near future.

[rwd59]

Another issue I have with this years version. Middle relievers making 25-35 million a year, No reliever should even come close to that. Edwin Diaz at an AAV of $20 million is the highest ever. This needs adjusting. No way I will pay that kind of money for a relief pitcher. I love this game and have bought every single version of the game. This version is the biggest disappointment to me since the infamous OOTP 7. Luckily all the issues are correctable if they want to and I'm sure they want to.

[Bobbyraz49]

Originally Posted by rwd59

Another issue I have with this years version. Middle relievers making 25-35 million a year, No reliever should even come close to that. Edwin Diaz at an AAV of $20 million is the highest ever. This needs adjusting. No way I will pay that kind of money for a relief pitcher. I love this game and have bought every single version of the game. This version is the biggest disappointment to me since the infamous OOTP 7. Luckily all the issues are correctable if they want to and I'm sure they want to.

What was the issue with 7 ? Thanks

[rwd59]

Originally Posted by Bobbyraz49

What was the issue with 7 ? Thanks

So long ago I can't remember all the details but it was a pretty much complete redo of the game after it was acquired by the company that does Football Manager and they tried to bring in some of the stuff that had already been developed for that game. The belief was that it would allow the game to grow and advance alot but it was a disaster. They actually came out with an OOTP 6.5 after the release that went back to most of the previous stuff from v6 with some additions that were developed for v7. If they had not came out with 6.5 I am not sure the game would still exist today.

[kq76]

Originally Posted by Bobbyraz49

What was the issue with 7 ? Thanks

There was no OOTP7. It went 6, 6.5, 2006, 2007, 8. This order can be confirmed by looking at the newsletter archive (the 6.5 newsletter was #15, 2006 was #19).

But other than that, yeah, 2006 was a "complete rewrite" and as a result it was found lacking by the fanbase. IIRC, it wasn't until 8, which itself was like 2007.5, that most thought it was worthy to move on from 6.5. 6.5 was pretty awesome though so it wasn't really that big of a problem to stick with it for a couple years.

Why the complete rewrite? Well, you have to keep in mind that Markus was a pretty new developer when he started OOTP and from OOTP99 to OOTP6.5 he was just building on top of his old code. And after a point the old framework was preventing him from really improving the game like he wanted to. Maybe think of it like trying to build a 21st century skyscraper over the framework of a medieval cathedral. You can try to do that, but it's really just best to start again from scratch as the base needs to support everything on top of it.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by rwd59

So long ago I can't remember all the details but it was a pretty much complete redo of the game after it was acquired by the company that does Football Manager and they tried to bring in some of the stuff that had already been developed for that game. The belief was that it would allow the game to grow and advance alot but it was a disaster. They actually came out with an OOTP 6.5 after the release that went back to most of the previous stuff from v6 with some additions that were developed for v7. If they had not came out with 6.5 I am not sure the game would still exist today.

6.5 came out the year before the SI version, OOTP2006. It was a "half version" as they didn't want to go a full year without any release.

That "disaster" is the base of all OOTP versions that followed it. Markus did not try to jam baseball into a "soccer engine" as many tried to say at the time. This is easily demonstrated as League Totals, League Total Modifiers, and other under the hood techniques were the base of OOTP before becoming a part of SI/FM. OOTP had begun the process of moving onto a saber metric/DIPS model before going to SI, where it was obviously developed further.

OOTP did use SI/FM techniques and their world data base of countries since FM was a world wide game. Hence the silly comments made at the time "I can play baseball in Ghana, but I can't do x,y, or z". Many users anticipated and wanted the front office depth and player interactions (I can talk to my players) that FM had, and some wanted the interaction with media among many other things FM did in depth. Would any of this have made it in if OOTP had stayed with SI? Who knows. SEGA took over SI/FM and their decision was they weren't going to publish OOTP. Markus moved on and retained all code for OOTP that was written under the SI umbrella.

[rwd59]

Originally Posted by kq76

There was no OOTP7. It went 6, 6.5, 2006, 2007, 8. This order can be confirmed by looking at the newsletter archive (the 6.5 newsletter was #15, 2006 was #19).

But other than that, yeah, 2006 was a "complete rewrite" and as a result it was found lacking by the fanbase. IIRC, it wasn't until 8, which itself was like 2007.5, that most thought it was worthy to move on from 6.5. 6.5 was pretty awesome though so it wasn't really that big of a problem to stick with it for a couple years.

Why the complete rewrite? Well, you have to keep in mind that Markus was a pretty new developer when he started OOTP and from OOTP99 to OOTP6.5 he was just building on top of his old code. And after a point the old framework was preventing him from really improving the game like he wanted to. Maybe think of it like trying to build a 21st century skyscraper over the framework of a medieval cathedral. You can try to do that, but it's really just best to start again from scratch as the base needs to support everything on top of it.

Like I said, my memory is kinda hazy on that. Well, it's getting kinda hazy on everything these days. I do remember 6.5 was awesome. I bought 2006 but found myself just continuing on with 6.5. TBH, I usually remove the previous version within a few days/weeks from my computer but I kept 6.5 on there for at least a couple of years. Honestly I wish I still had it.

[rwd59]

Originally Posted by Sweed

6.5 came out the year before the SI version, OOTP2006. It was a "half version" as they didn't want to go a full year without any release.

That "disaster" is the base of all OOTP versions that followed it.

OOTP did use SI/FM techniques and their world data base of countries since FM was a world wide game. Hence the silly comments made at the time "I can play baseball in Ghana, but I can't do x,y, or z". Many users anticipated and wanted the front office depth and player interactions (I can talk to my players) that FM had, and some wanted the interaction with media among many other things FM did in depth. Would any of this have made it in if OOTP had stayed with SI? Who knows. SEGA took over SI/FM and their decision was they weren't going to publish OOTP. Markus moved on and retained all code for OOTP that was written under the SI umbrella.

Again thank you for refreshing my hazy memory. I agree that the move was a great move long term for the game. But I don't think you will find many people who were even remotely happy with that first SI version. Two or three years down the road I would say most of those opinions changed.

[low]

Bloated reliever contracts have been a problem for years. I really wish it would be addressed. The financials need some love.

[Guthrien]

It started to spin out of control in 25, and in 26 it's locked in. You're paying generational salaries for top tier relievers. 40 million mark a few years in.

Here's some of the best relivers as of today:
Josh Hader, 5-year, $95M deal (2024–2028)
Edwin Diaz 5-year, $102M deal (2023–2027)
Raisel Iglesias 4-year, $58M deal (2022–2025)
Tanner Scott 4-year, $72M deal with $21M deferred
Devin Williams 8.6 million
Jeff Hoffman 3-year, $33M deal; $6M in 2025, $11M in 2026–27

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by rwd59

Again thank you for refreshing my hazy memory. I agree that the move was a great move long term for the game. But I don't think you will find many people who were even remotely happy with that first SI version. Two or three years down the road I would say most of those opinions changed.

Yeah, it was a necessary step to move the game forward. I wasn't surprised that the first version was rough. As a manage every inning of every game user, I tolerated it. It wasn't unplayable to me. No idea how it worked for those that sim long term baseball worlds or online leagues.

[rwd59]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Yeah, it was a necessary step to move the game forward.

My mind slips on alot of things as I entered retirement a few years ago. But there are some things and people associated with this game and board I will never forget. Let me drop a couple of names. Malleus Dei and The Wolf!

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by rwd59

My mind slips on alot of things as I entered retirement a few years ago. But there are some things and people associated with this game and board I will never forget. Let me drop a couple of names. Malleus Dei and The Wolf!

Uncle and nephew if I recall correctly. I don't recall where they stood on removing clutch as a feature or going to the DIPS and saber metric models? I could see MD arguing it either way. Maybe I should say ARGUING!!! He was a good read.

[rwd59]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Uncle and nephew if I recall correctly. I don't recall where they stood on removing clutch as a feature or going to the DIPS and saber metric models? I could see MD arguing it either way. Maybe I should say ARGUING!!! He was a good read.

According to the stats, Malleus left in 2010 and the Wolf in 2015. I am quite sure that Malleus would not be happy with the touchy/feely don't hurt anyone's feelings way things have gone since he left. He sure didn't mind hurting feelings for sure.