Catcher: Low fielding EFF value

[GBL]

Hello everyone, I have a question about my EFF statistics.


My catcher has an fielding eff of 0.374 and i wonder how that is possible.

His positinal Ratings are:
Catcher 65, Catcher Ability 70, Catcher Arm 55.

with values like these, i would expect an eff greater than 1.0.
assumption: 1.0 is the average, anything greater than 1.0 is better than the average.

unfortunately i can't post any pictures, otherwise i would show the whole statistics.

[Pelican]

Hmmm I know one response you'll get is how many games you have played with this catcher. If the sample size is too small, then greater variance could be expected, along with a gradual return toward the mean, and so forth. (I am assuming that EFF is a derived stat, rather than a rating. If I'm wrong in that, please disregard.) The other variables would be league environment and its effect on performance. Are other catchers experiencing the same thing? That, after sufficient play to normalize stats, might suggest that an adjustment to your league AI settings is in order. That's beyond my present grasp; but there is another thread on ratings and stats where others have studied discrepancies and suggest fixes.

[Brad K]

What is your setting for scouting accuracy? Is there a difference between the rating give by your scout and the OOTP scout?

[GBL]

Hello Pelican,
hello Brad K,


thx for the answeres.


The Catcher player 48 Games for 409 Innings.
His ratings at the editor are:
Catching ability: 171
catcher arm: 110
Experience: 200 (Result Rating: 157)


Infielding error: 38 (very low).
Errors in 48 Games: 4

[BirdWatcher]

Considering that defensive efficiency is a measure of the proportion of balls put in play in their zone that are turned into outs, it needs to be remembered that for catchers this is mostly popups and squibbers or bunts in front of the plate.
While catcher defense is crucial this measure is a very small part of what a catcher does defensively and given the sample size in your question the total chances we are talking about is going to be small enough that those 4 errors can have inordinate impact on the stat.

It should be noted (as I understand it anyway) that Catcher Ability is a rating that incorporates a number of things, including error propensity, for a catcher. That infield error rating you referred to only comes into play if you play that particular player at first base, second base, third base, or shortstop. (And, of course, if you did play him at one of these positions- assuming he had skills enough to play that position and got some experience- he would commit a high number of errors. That is what a low infield error rating means. Think of error ratings as actually being ability to avoid committing an error ratings.)

Sounds like he muffed a few plays and given the rather small number of total chances we are talking about it has led to a low defensive efficiency statistic. I wouldn't worry about it. No doubt in many other more important ways and as measured by other statistical tools he is helping your team.

Edit: I should probably have added that this particular statistic is far more useful as a team measurement than as an individual player measurement. And while I can't be sure of this, I suspect it is even less useful as a way of measuring catcher defense than for almost any other position.

[Brad K]

Since you have his real ratings ignore the stats.

[GBL]

Hello BirdWatcher,


an interesting explanation for the eff value. i had not thought of it that way. But of course, how do you determine the eff for a catcher? it's certainly easier with an RF.


you said that the infield error value would not play a role in the Errors. I would directly agree with you, but the game would have the value (the value can also be seen under ratings). so the game could use this to calculate the erros of the catcher.

in my test league (2 teams, completely identical teams) i only changed the values of one catcher and gave him an infield error rating of 250. the other catcher had a rating of 0.
Result: The errors over 324 games were about the same, about 15. this means that only the two catcher ratings are used to calculate the errors. The infield error really doesn't matter.

[GBL]

Originally Posted by Brad K

Since you have his real ratings ignore the stats.

Hello Brad,


my problem is, i have to decide if i want to change the catcher. Unfortunately, he doesn't hit anything, I only have him for the defense in the team. and there he is apparently lousy, despite the super ratings.

The CERA values are now also not exhilarating. They are only 0.2 better than those of the replacement.

That's why I got a new catcher. hopefully he'll give me more hits and a few homeruns. That will help me win a few more games.

[BirdWatcher]

Originally Posted by GBL

Hello BirdWatcher,




you said that the infield error value would not play a role in the Errors. I would directly agree with you, but the game would have the value (the value can also be seen under ratings). so the game could use this to calculate the erros of the catcher.

in my test league (2 teams, completely identical teams) i only changed the values of one catcher and gave him an infield error rating of 250. the other catcher had a rating of 0.
Result: The errors over 324 games were about the same, about 15. this means that only the two catcher ratings are used to calculate the errors. The infield error really doesn't matter.

This is the wording directly from the OOTP Manual:

"Catcher Ability
Catcher Ability is a measure of a catcher's overall catching skill. Catcher Ability isn't truly a distinct rating. It is more of a composite number based on a combination of the player's defensive skills (arm, error, range) and his experience at the position."

So, yes, to reiterate and clarify, infield error ratings have nothing to do with errors made by a player while playing the position of catcher. There is no specific error rating for this position but rather a complex number of things interact within the over-arching rating called Catcher Ability.

(I'm perhaps a bit confused by the wording in your post above, but it seems like we are ultimately saying the same thing- that we have reached the same conclusion. Right?)

[GBL]

Originally Posted by BirdWatcher

This is the wording directly from the OOTP Manual:

"Catcher Ability
Catcher Ability is a measure of a catcher's overall catching skill. Catcher Ability isn't truly a distinct rating. It is more of a composite number based on a combination of the player's defensive skills (arm, error, range) and his experience at the position."

So, yes, to reiterate and clarify, infield error ratings have nothing to do with errors made by a player while playing the position of catcher. There is no specific error rating for this position but rather a complex number of things interact within the over-arching rating called Catcher Ability.

(I'm perhaps a bit confused by the wording in your post above, but it seems like we are ultimately saying the same thing- that we have reached the same conclusion. Right?)

Hello BirdWatcher,


sorry about my wording (i used a translator).


Yes, we say the same thing "error rating doesnt matter for catchers". Your mentioned the manual and i ran a test in ootp to prove it. You/we are totaly right!

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by GBL

Hello Brad,


my problem is, i have to decide if i want to change the catcher. Unfortunately, he doesn't hit anything, I only have him for the defense in the team. and there he is apparently lousy, despite the super ratings.

The CERA values are now also not exhilarating. They are only 0.2 better than those of the replacement.

That's why I got a new catcher. hopefully he'll give me more hits and a few homeruns. That will help me win a few more games.

You know his true ability and that is what the game engine uses as the input. If the output isn't as good as the input that's chance at work.

[BirdWatcher]

Originally Posted by GBL

Hello BirdWatcher,


sorry about my wording (i used a translator).


Yes, we say the same thing "error rating doesnt matter for catchers". Your mentioned the manual and i ran a test in ootp to prove it. You/we are totaly right!

(And apologies for my wordiness as I did not realize that we might speak different native languages and my usage of the English language isn't the most direct or concise.)