Not perfect, but I'll take it

David Watts · 06-20-2022, 11:21 AM

I've been bummed ever since OOTP16, as since then it's been pretty much impossible to create historical leagues and erase all history/stats. You can do so, but the following year if any player missed the year you started and returns, their return comes with all their career stats. So if you start in 1921 and erase all stats, when 1922 rolls around Johnny Evers will appear with all his stats from 1902-1917.

Last week I was messing around and if you start in 1901 and erase all stats/history, it appears as though you can play forward without any problems caused by players returning to the fold with all their career stats. I will take this small victory as I don't like allowing the pre1901 stats on the historical leaderboard. This also allows one to create fictional leagues that use historical players with zero ties to the real history of baseball other than debut years.

So what I'm doing now is fast simming each season till September 1 and then grinding out the AL and NL pennant races. Boston ran away with the AL and just clinched on September 16, 1902. The NL is still undecided with Philadelphia, Chicago and Pittsburgh all in contention. Chicago might fall out of the race first as they struggled over he last week. My money is on the Phillies.

Brad K · 06-21-2022, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

I've been bummed ever since OOTP16, as since then it's been pretty much impossible to create historical leagues and erase all history/stats. You can do so, but the following year if any player missed the year you started and returns, their return comes with all their career stats. So if you start in 1921 and erase all stats, when 1922 rolls around Johnny Evers will appear with all his stats from 1902-1917.

Has there been a change in 23 that prevents use of the solution described here in post 11?

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...=erase+history

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

Has there been a change in 23 that prevents use of the solution described here in post 11?

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...=erase+history

I remember that discussion, but I think I ended up having issues using it as well with guys coming back with stats. May have been someone that didn't get drafted or something.

Brad K · 06-21-2022, 09:32 AM

I have had zero problems using that procedure. You're doing something different than I am. I play historical rookies but I don't see how having a draft would affect it. Players in the draft have no prior history.

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

I have had zero problems using that procedure. You're doing something different than I am. I play historical rookies but I don't see how having a draft would affect it. Players in the draft have no prior history.

I agree, it's might be something I did wrong. I'm just glad it looks like I can start in 1901 and things work without being forced to use minor leagues.

I can't remember, did you erase all history for your Pirates replay? For some reason, I think I remember you saying you didn't, but you also didn't import entire history.

Reed · 06-21-2022, 10:49 AM

I know there are workarounds and I have used them in the past.
Instead of going through loops, It would be nice to set a historical year without having to jump through hoops so I get where David is coming from. I am no developer so maybe it is not easy as I think it should be.

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reed

I know there are workarounds and I have used them in the past.
Instead of going through loops, It would be nice to set a historical year without having to jump through hoops so I get where David is coming from. I am no developer so maybe it is not easy as I think it should be.

I'm not a huge fan of using minor leagues. I have trouble getting stats to look right in minor leagues. I don't manage or gm, so in order to get emails highlighting top news stories, I have to set things to entire world. That means if I have minor leagues I have to sift through stories about stuff happening in AA or AAA. That might not be all that bad if my minor leagues are full, but let's face it, they're more often than not 5 or 6 players and then the rest are ghosts.

It's something to do with how the new historical db is constructed. Prior to 17 it was easy as pie to erase stats/history. But, it did have it's drawbacks. If you started in say 1944, you would never get Williams, DiMaggio, Greenberg ever. If you started in 1905, you would get Eddie Cicotte, but if you started in 06 or 07 he would never appear in your game as he made his debut in 05 and didn't play again till 1908.

I'm at work right now, but I wonder what happens if you start a league and delete all the players that are in the free agent pool upon creation.

But in the end, since I can start in 1901 and it works, I'm now at least 80% a happy camper. If I could start in say 1947, I would be 100% happy.

I'm really enjoying playing out September and watching the pennant races.

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 11:43 AM

I'm entering the final week of 1902. Philadelphia holds a game and half lead over Pittsburgh for the NL. Boston already clinched the AL.

I have this league setup to use 5 man rotations, always start the highest rested. Each team has 1 pitcher in the bullpen. I'm using the DH. It's kind of strange, as some teams will use their bullpen while some teams use him sparingly and spread all the relief appearances over the entire staff. But, teams not pinch hitting for pitchers seems to make end of the year usage resemble real life, better than the non dh leagues I've played during this period.

I still say if a tweak could be made to the 6 man rotation, always start the highest rested, pitcher usage during this period would be much better. We need to be able to set the rotation to 6, always start the highest rested and leave the bullpen completely empty. Problem is, right now the minute you set the game to a 6 man rotation, always start the highest rested, the game operates with a 5 man rotation that skips the 6th man when the top guy is rested. This means when playing a 154 game schedule, guys are going to be getting around 30 starts at most. It needs to operate exactly like it does when you use 5 man rotation, always start the highest rested. The top 3 guys should get the meat of the starts with the 4th guy getting semi regular starts and the 5th getting starts on a as needed basis. The 6th guy should only get starts when the staff is in dire need. The ultimate goal should be to get to a point where you see zero pitchers making 20 relief appearances or more without ever starting a game.

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 12:05 PM

By the way, I've been playing OOTP since it was called Season Ticket 2. Not sure if that matters, but based on the behavior in other threads, I guess it's important that I make all of you aware. I can email you my reputation credentials if you would like. Ugh!!!!

Brad K · 06-21-2022, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

I agree, it's might be something I did wrong. I'm just glad it looks like I can start in 1901 and things work without being forced to use minor leagues.

I can't remember, did you erase all history for your Pirates replay? For some reason, I think I remember you saying you didn't, but you also didn't import entire history.

I imported entire history, erased entire history (there are two or three buttons for different types and I hit them all), and then assigned all the free agents to their correct teams.

(Remember a normal 1951 start gives you only players who played MLB in 1951. Entire history gives you players who didn't play MLB in 1951 but played MLB before and after 1951 and the show up as free agents.)

Brad K · 06-21-2022, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

I'm not a huge fan of using minor leagues. I have trouble getting stats to look right in minor leagues. I don't manage or gm, so in order to get emails highlighting top news stories, I have to set things to entire world. That means if I have minor leagues I have to sift through stories about stuff happening in AA or AAA. That might not be all that bad if my minor leagues are full, but let's face it, they're more often than not 5 or 6 players and then the rest are ghosts.

Having minor leagues doesn't mean you have to pay any attention to them. There's no reason to care about stats in minor leagues where, as you observe, many players are ghost players. Actually there's no reason to care about anything in the minors if you don't want to.

Rain King · 06-21-2022, 01:16 PM

Has anyone tried importing full minors, but then deleting the minor leagues each year? I'm wondering if that would cause any issues as a historical game moves to the next season.

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

Having minor leagues doesn't mean you have to pay any attention to them. There's no reason to care about stats in minor leagues where, as you observe, many players are ghost players. Actually there's no reason to care about anything in the minors if you don't want to.

I know, but I tend to let some crazy things drive me nuts.

David Watts · 06-21-2022, 08:14 PM

Holy Pitch counts!!! Name: what_is_she_doing_1902-10-11_19-13-10.jpg
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Brad K · 06-22-2022, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

I know, but I tend to let some crazy things drive me nuts.

Well, if I ever want to irritate you I know I can have the OOTP devs do it for me!!!

David Watts · 06-22-2022, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

Well, if I ever want to irritate you I know I can have the OOTP devs do it for me!!!

Yeah, probably why I'm a serial league starter/stopper guy.

David Watts · 06-22-2022, 09:33 AM

The Philadelphia Phillies defeated the Boston American in 6 games to win the 1902 World Series. That's 2 in a row for the Phillies and it looks like they will defend their crown again in 1903, as they lead the NL by 8 games on September 3rd.

The AL is a lot closer race this year. The Philadelphia Athletics are 2 games up on Washington to start September.

Brad K · 06-22-2022, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Watts

Yeah, probably why I'm a serial league starter/stopper guy.

I've noticed that!

I don't think I'm a serial starter/stopper but I'm tiring of the Pirates save. Bonds is not going to set any records and I don't like rosters with 12 pitchers. I may stop it after 50 years and take a break.

David Watts · 06-22-2022, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad K

I've noticed that!

I don't think I'm a serial starter/stopper but I'm tiring of the Pirates save. Bonds is not going to set any records and I don't like rosters with 12 pitchers. I may stop it after 50 years and take a break.

It's funny, I always start and stop a lot when a new version appears. Then usually around the World Series I lock into a league that I fall in love with and play it right up to when the new version comes out. So far with 23, I'm doing the exact same thing. No biggie, as I can start a league and play a month and enjoy it to no end.

David Watts · 06-28-2022, 09:53 AM

Well so much for that. Got home yesterday from a trip to the Houston area and finished up 1903. The Phillies won their 3rd straight World Series. Move through the offseason and did my fast sim of 1904 till September 1st. Realized I forgot to check the historical leaderboard prior to the start of the season. Ugh! The leaderboard was the Dan Brouthers Johnson show. Brouthers was back at 46 years old with all his stats dating back to 1879. Yippee. Was really enjoying this league without all the pre 1901 nonsense. Oh well.

06-20-2022, 11:21 AM	#1
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,601 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Not perfect, but I'll take it I've been bummed ever since OOTP16, as since then it's been pretty much impossible to create historical leagues and erase all history/stats. You can do so, but the following year if any player missed the year you started and returns, their return comes with all their career stats. So if you start in 1921 and erase all stats, when 1922 rolls around Johnny Evers will appear with all his stats from 1902-1917. Last week I was messing around and if you start in 1901 and erase all stats/history, it appears as though you can play forward without any problems caused by players returning to the fold with all their career stats. I will take this small victory as I don't like allowing the pre1901 stats on the historical leaderboard. This also allows one to create fictional leagues that use historical players with zero ties to the real history of baseball other than debut years. So what I'm doing now is fast simming each season till September 1 and then grinding out the AL and NL pennant races. Boston ran away with the AL and just clinched on September 16, 1902. The NL is still undecided with Philadelphia, Chicago and Pittsburgh all in contention. Chicago might fall out of the race first as they struggled over he last week. My money is on the Phillies.

06-21-2022, 09:32 AM	#4
Brad K Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2016 Location: St Petersburg Florida USA Posts: 6,657 Infractions: 0/2 (3)	I have had zero problems using that procedure. You're doing something different than I am. I play historical rookies but I don't see how having a draft would affect it. Players in the draft have no prior history. __________________ . Pirates Play Moneyball 1951-2008 Ratings and League Totals Modifiers A new pre-calc file! (Applause!) Settings and Auto-calc Popular Opinions and Undisputable Facts The cover up is usually more damaging than the original act.

06-21-2022, 11:43 AM	#8
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,601 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	I'm entering the final week of 1902. Philadelphia holds a game and half lead over Pittsburgh for the NL. Boston already clinched the AL. I have this league setup to use 5 man rotations, always start the highest rested. Each team has 1 pitcher in the bullpen. I'm using the DH. It's kind of strange, as some teams will use their bullpen while some teams use him sparingly and spread all the relief appearances over the entire staff. But, teams not pinch hitting for pitchers seems to make end of the year usage resemble real life, better than the non dh leagues I've played during this period. I still say if a tweak could be made to the 6 man rotation, always start the highest rested, pitcher usage during this period would be much better. We need to be able to set the rotation to 6, always start the highest rested and leave the bullpen completely empty. Problem is, right now the minute you set the game to a 6 man rotation, always start the highest rested, the game operates with a 5 man rotation that skips the 6th man when the top guy is rested. This means when playing a 154 game schedule, guys are going to be getting around 30 starts at most. It needs to operate exactly like it does when you use 5 man rotation, always start the highest rested. The top 3 guys should get the meat of the starts with the 4th guy getting semi regular starts and the 5th getting starts on a as needed basis. The 6th guy should only get starts when the staff is in dire need. The ultimate goal should be to get to a point where you see zero pitchers making 20 relief appearances or more without ever starting a game. Last edited by David Watts; 06-21-2022 at 11:58 AM.

06-21-2022, 10:49 AM	#6
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,339	I know there are workarounds and I have used them in the past. Instead of going through loops, It would be nice to set a historical year without having to jump through hoops so I get where David is coming from. I am no developer so maybe it is not easy as I think it should be.

06-21-2022, 12:05 PM	#9
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,601 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	By the way, I've been playing OOTP since it was called Season Ticket 2. Not sure if that matters, but based on the behavior in other threads, I guess it's important that I make all of you aware. I can email you my reputation credentials if you would like. Ugh!!!!

06-21-2022, 01:16 PM	#12
Rain King Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 3,072 Infractions: 1/1 (1)	Has anyone tried importing full minors, but then deleting the minor leagues each year? I'm wondering if that would cause any issues as a historical game moves to the next season.

06-21-2022, 08:14 PM	#14
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,601 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Holy Pitch counts!!!

06-22-2022, 09:33 AM	#17
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,601 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	The Philadelphia Phillies defeated the Boston American in 6 games to win the 1902 World Series. That's 2 in a row for the Phillies and it looks like they will defend their crown again in 1903, as they lead the NL by 8 games on September 3rd. The AL is a lot closer race this year. The Philadelphia Athletics are 2 games up on Washington to start September.

06-28-2022, 09:53 AM	#20
David Watts Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Looking for a place called Leehofooks Posts: 9,601 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Well so much for that. Got home yesterday from a trip to the Houston area and finished up 1903. The Phillies won their 3rd straight World Series. Move through the offseason and did my fast sim of 1904 till September 1st. Realized I forgot to check the historical leaderboard prior to the start of the season. Ugh! The leaderboard was the Dan Brouthers Johnson show. Brouthers was back at 46 years old with all his stats dating back to 1879. Yippee. Was really enjoying this league without all the pre 1901 nonsense. Oh well.