Sir Lurksalot photopack (Negro League players)

[Cusick]

Clarence Coleman was a catcher with the Indianapolis Clowns in 1956 and 1957. I've also seen newspaper articles which showed him with the New York Black Yankees for both of those years. I'm not sure whether the two teams loaned him back and forth, or whether there was a mistake in the newspaper reporting. He is shown here in a New York Mets uniform. The photo is from the baseballhappenings.net website.

[FatJack]

Originally Posted by Cusick

Clarence Coleman was a catcher with the Indianapolis Clowns in 1956 and 1957. I've also seen newspaper articles which showed him with the New York Black Yankees for both of those years. I'm not sure whether the two teams loaned him back and forth, or whether there was a mistake in the newspaper reporting. He is shown here in a New York Mets uniform. The photo is from the baseballhappenings.net website.

Highly unlikely that Choo Choo played for the NY Black Yankees as they folded in 1948 (as did the entirety of the Negro National League). Historians view 1951 as the final "regular" season for the Negro Leagues. Although a loose conglomeration continued under the heading of the Negro American League through 1958, the number of teams and the quality of play had diminished to the point of insignificance. The quality Negro League players had either been signed into the pros or joined barnstorming teams that played mostly exhibitions against local, company, semi-pro, and minor league teams or league all-star squads. Most of these ceased operation entirely in the 60s though the Indianapolis Clowns continued into the 80s, but more as entertainment than serious competition.

[Cusick]

Charles "Charlie" McCoy was an outfielder with the 1955 New York Black Yankees. He also played in the minor leagues in 1953, 1954, and 1957. He is shown here with the St. Petersburg Saints. The photo is from the St. Petersburg Times of June 24, 1957.

[FatJack]

Speaking of the Indianapolis Clowns, here is Dero Austin--all 31 inches of him. Dero followed in the footsteps of Clowns' star Spec Bebop. Bebop, a comedian by trade, never actually played. He would do pantomime and skits between innings and was one of the most popular Clowns in the 50s. Dero joined the clowns in the 60s. He'd be listed at various positions (2B, SS, C, etc.), but never actually took the field. He would lead off the game, reprising the Eddie Gaedel at bat, and then be lifted from the game. Though he never did take the field, publicity shots were taken showing him at various positions (in this case, catcher). Austin stuck with the Clowns well into the 70s--billed, in later years, as the team's manager. But he never achieved the popularity of Spec Bebop.

[Cusick]

Originally Posted by FatJack

Highly unlikely that Choo Choo played for the NY Black Yankees as they folded in 1948 (as did the entirety of the Negro National League). Historians view 1951 as the final "regular" season for the Negro Leagues. Although a loose conglomeration continued under the heading of the Negro American League through 1958, the number of teams and the quality of play had diminished to the point of insignificance. The quality Negro League players had either been signed into the pros or joined barnstorming teams that played mostly exhibitions against local, company, semi-pro, and minor league teams or league all-star squads. Most of these ceased operation entirely in the 60s though the Indianapolis Clowns continued into the 80s, but more as entertainment than serious competition.

There is disagreement among historians as to when the Negro Leagues ended. I covered that topic in some detail under a posting called "Progress" on the following webpage:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post3784213

I would agree that the Indianapolis Clowns were in more of a barnstorming mode than playing as a competitive team by the mid-1950's, but I have chosen for purposes of posting on this forum and creating a Negro League Image Index to keep the image collection going for players who arrived on the scene as late as 1959. This doesn't seem to be in total conflict with other legitimate efforts, as I've seen the Chair of SABR's Negro League Committee featuring players from the later 1950's in his books, and I've noted players of the same era on the website of the Negro League Museum.

As for Choo Choo Coleman's being with the New York Black Yankees, the following article from the Tennessean (Nashville) of July 27, 1957 is attached for your perusal.

[FatJack]

Originally Posted by Cusick

There is disagreement among historians as to when the Negro Leagues ended. I covered that topic in some detail under a posting called "Progress" on the following webpage:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...eply&p=4081272

I would agree that the Indianapolis Clowns were in more of a barnstorming mode than playing as a competitive team by the mid-1950's, but I have chosen for purposes of posting on this forum and creating a Negro League Image Index to keep the image collection going for players who arrived on the scene as late as 1959. This doesn't seem to be in total conflict with other legitimate efforts, as I've seen the Chair of SABR's Negro League Committee featuring players from the later 1950's in his books, and I've noted players of the same era on the website of the Negro League Museum.

As for Choo Choo Coleman's being with the New York Black Yankees, the following article from the Tennessean (Nashville) of July 27, 1957 is attached for your perusal.

I would suggest--since there is no disagreement among historians as to the demise of the NY Black Yankees--that any game (after 1948) purporting to feature that team was, essentially, a split squad game (with, perhaps, some local talent recruited for the day--as indicated here in the person of Mike Smith). The Negro American League absorbed (in 1949) the remaining Negro National League teams. The New York Black Yankees, who played the 1948 season in Rochester, were not one of them.

[Cusick]

Originally Posted by FatJack

I would suggest--since there is no disagreement among historians as to the demise of the NY Black Yankees--that any game (after 1948) purporting to feature that team was, essentially, a split squad game (with, perhaps, some local talent recruited for the day--as indicated here in the person of Mike Smith). The Negro American League absorbed (in 1949) the remaining Negro National League teams. The New York Black Yankees, who played the 1948 season in Rochester, were not one of them.

You keep saying there is no disagreement among historians, but I keep finding differences. For example, in the NEGRO LEAGUES BOOK, by Dick Clark and Larry Lester, who were the co-chairs of SABR's Negro Leagues Research Committee (Dick is now deceased), they were still publishing rosters for the New York Black Yankees as of 1951. In the Negro Baseball Register section of that book, for example, outfielder Fred Logan is included, and his only Negro Leagues experience was with the 1950 New York Black Yankees. So your termination point of 1948 for that team is definitely in conflict with the views of Clark and Lester as it pertains to an official reference about the Negro Leagues.

I don't know where you are trying to go with this argument in terms of what occurs on this thread. I tried to explain in the "Progress" posting more than a year and a half ago that there is no easy answer for drawing a line on when the Negro Leagues era ended, so I simply chose one that was reasonably expansionary, so that we wouldn't leave very many players out. That seemed to be a better approach than being restrictive.

[Cusick]

Don Feabry was a shortstop on the 1956 Indianapolis Clowns. The photo comes from the Carnegie Museum of Art - Charles "Teenie" Harris Photo Collection. It shows Fearby in the basketball uniform of the Fifth Avenue High School in Pittsburgh.

[Cusick]

Ed Morris pitched for the Kansas City Monarchs in 1949. Although I could not find Ed in any of the Negro Leagues reference books, an article and box score in the Eugene (OR) Register-Guard of August 2, 1949, describe him as a Monarchs' hurler recently acquired from the Chicago Bombers and show that he was the only pitcher for Kansas City as they shut out the Eugene All-Stars 8-0 the previous night.

The photo shows Ed during a tryout with the Pittsburgh Pirates during the spring of 1951. It is from the Pittsburgh Press of March 9, 1951.

[mitchkenn]

i couldn't find anything on Ed Morris in my few books either. But i find it interesting the Register Guard would cover the Negro Leagues. It must have been a better newspaper back then.

[Cusick]

Photos of third baseman Joe Henry have been posted on this thread previously. They were on the following webpages:
Sir Lurksalot photopack (Negro League and Nippon players) - Page 28 - OOTP Developments Forums
Sir Lurksalot photopack (Negro League and Nippon players) - Page 138 - OOTP Developments Forums

This is the first one to show him with the Indianapolis Clowns. He was with the Clowns in 1955, 1956 and 1957.

[Cusick]

Two photos of this third baseman have previously been posted on this thread. They were at:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post3781987
and
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ayers-142.html

This photo is an upgrade. It shows him with the Oriente Baseball Club of Cuba. It's from a current auction by Lelands.com.

[Cusick]

Outfielder Jim Zapp died on September 30 at Age 92. He had played in the Negro Leagues for the Baltimore Elite Giants (1945-46), Nashville Cubs (1946), Atlanta Black Crackers (1947), and Birmingham Black Barons (1948, 1954).

The photos show him with the Birmingham Black Barons (left) and Big Spring Broncs (right). They are from the baseballhappenings.net website.

[FatJack]

Originally Posted by Cusick

Outfielder Jim Zapp died on September 30 at Age 92. He had played in the Negro Leagues for the Baltimore Elite Giants (1945-46), Nashville Cubs (1946), Atlanta Black Crackers (1947), and Birmingham Black Barons (1948, 1954).

The photos show him with the Birmingham Black Barons (left) and Big Spring Broncs (right). They are from the baseballhappenings.net website.

Love his nickname--"Zipper".

Since Topps had used the Broncs photo in their A&G set years ago, I took a stab at colorizing the Birmingham one. Both images also appear on eBay, with the Barons image coming from a postcard. Unfortunately, that's what the postcard image looks like--there is no sharper or cleaner version of that image in circulation. So the resulting colorization is a bit "toasty".

[57Will]

Was Bill Gatewood really six feet seven inches tall?

[Spritze]

New York Black Yankees 1955-1957 as a member of Negro Independent Leagues. Coleman was indeed on the 1957 version. They played anyone that would pay them for so doing.

[mitchkenn]

Originally Posted by 57Will

Was Bill Gatewood really six feet seven inches tall?

According to BB Reference:
Bill Gatewood
William Miller Gatewood
Positions: Pitcher, Rightfielder and First Baseman
Bats: Right, Throws: Right
Height: 6' 0", Weight: 195 lb.
Born: August 22, 1881 in San Antonio, Texas, United States
Died: December 8, 1962 in Columbia, Missouri, United States (Aged 81.108)

According to Seamheads:
William Miller Gatewood (Big Bill)
Born: Aug 22 1881 - San Antonio TX
Died: Dec 8, 1962 Columbia MO
B: R T: R HT: 6'0" W: 195

So i would say - based on these sources, he was not 6'7".

[Cusick]

This is an improved photo of Sampson. When the previous photo of Sampson was posted in December of 2014, he was referred to as Unknown-first-name Sampson. He was a pitcher and outfielder for the Genuine Cuban Giants and the Cuban Giants during the 1899-1906 period.

[Cusick]

Two photos have been posted on this thread showing Nate Harris with the Leland Giants, but this is the first to show him in the uniform of the Cuban Giants. He was a second baseman and outfielder.

[57Will]

I would love to see those new Negro League pics You can send them to dwop572@gmail.com