Gambo and T_Wil1 Photopack

[Rainmaker]

This came as part of a remarkable assortment from Frosty Malt a couple of years ago. Not a Vault photo.

[Merkle923]

Lots of him in black and white (see below, from an Atlanta team-issued photo from 1966), but most memorable for sharing a rookie card with Herb Hippauf (what could get the attention of a seven-year old faster than a baseball card featuring Hippauf and Umbach).

But leave it to Dexter to grab him after the Braves dealt him to the Astros in the off-season of 1966-67. Umbach quit early in 1968 and finished up his degree at Auburn, and went into the record books with one career win - in his first start (1964) and saved for him by Warren Spahn.

And, yes, I've seen two black-and-white images of Umbach in Houston's camp at Cocoa, Florida, and in each he's also wearing what appear to be glasses held together by athletic tape.

[Merkle923]

Again, Dexter fills a spot. There's a color Brace photo of the well-traveled catcher in a Phillies' uniform but this is the first portrait I've seen.

Schaffer may be the quintessential third-string catcher of the '60s. He played eight years, and started exactly 160 games.

[cheech411]

merkle i have a list of players u might have IM NOT TELLING WHAT TO DO !! JUST GIVING U NAMES THATS ALL HOUSTON 67 D WILSON J LANDIS A POINTER C HARRIS J HERERA J OWENS B VON HOFF TIGERS 67 B MONBOUQUETTE G KORINCE O PENA L SHERRY THANKS NO RUSH players on list played only a short time on these teams

[cheech411]

REDS j bench as a very young player t davidson d osteen floyd robinson j wood ps only trying to help

[Rainmaker]

The Tuesday release for the Topps Vault was the least organized yet tasty assortment in a while. Almost like someone was pulling stuff out while blindfolded. We'll admit to a couple of these being educated guesses, but this is more of an attempt to move the debate forward. ALL CONFIRMED CORRECTIONS ARE NOW ADDED.

Also featured is another couple of good photos of Dodgers minor leaguer Walter Adey, who was one of Merkle's Greatest Hits a couple of years ago.

It did wind up with some sharp, nice batting images for journeyman first baseman Mike Fiore with the Red Sox and Royals. It seemed like a rule that Topps had to run photos of him stretching for a throw, but it turns out they let him hold a bat as well.



FOLDER KE
321-322 Don Taussig; 323-324 Willard Schmidt; 325-326 Seth Morehead; 327-328 Joe Cunningham; 329-330 Mario Guerrero; 331-332 Joe Orsulak; 333-334 Ferguson Jenkins; 335-336 Jessie Reid; 337-338 Bert Blyleven; 339-340 Greg Shanahan; 341-342 Burke Suter (Phillies' minor leaguer); 343-344 Al Schroll; 345-346 Jose Pena; 347-348 Carl Nichols; 349-350 Walter Adey (Dodgers minor league); 351-352 Vito Valentini (Cubs min.); 353-354 Sal Maglie; 355-356 Duke Maas; 357-360 Mike Fiore.

Thanks to hobbsl11, nailing Shanahan. Keonleafs for fixing Taussig, Moreland and Adey. And to Merkle for nailing down Suter cold. Since this is OP, we will fix all corrections here. FIXED to include Valentini!

Happy New Year/

[hobbs11]

Originally Posted by Rainmaker

The Tuesday release for the Topps Vault


FOLDER KE
321-322 Norm Larker; 323-324 Willard Schmidt; 325-326 Dick Drott; 327-328 Joe Cunningham; 329-330 Mario Guerrero; 331-332 Joe Orsulak;333-334 Ferguson Jenkins; 335-336 Jessie Reid; 337-338 Bert Blyleven; 339-340 Barry Raziano(?); 341-342 Jose de Jesus; 343-344 Al Schroll; 345-346 Jose Pena; 347-348 Carl Nichols(?); 349-350 Walter Aday (Dodgers minor league); 351-352 Mike Garman(?); 353-354 Sal Maglie; 355-356 Duke Maas; 357-360 Mike Fiore.


Happy New Year/

I'm of the strong belief that 339 & 340 is Greg Shanahan who was in the Royals camp in Omaha back in '77. Prior to that he had a short run with the Dodgers in the early 70s....

[SPORTSMEM817]

Digest: Ex-Patterson Park, Orioles pitcher Jim Lehew dies at 79 - Baltimore Sun

[Rainmaker]

Originally Posted by hobbs11

I'm of the strong belief that 339 & 340 is Greg Shanahan who was in the Royals camp in Omaha back in '77. Prior to that he had a short run with the Dodgers in the early 70s....

I was guilty of wishful thinking, since we've had several of Raziano with the Angels, but none with the Royals -- for whom he actually played. It is no doubt Shanahan, as he was previously in the Vault in a similar series of images in Folder GS 007-008.

[baseball-birthdays.com]

John Leister, 1987 Boston Red Sox, the image is sampled from one found at The Greatest 21 Days

[keonleafs]

ke321-22 is Don Taussig (Colts 45 1962) not Larker

ke325-26 is Seth Morehead not Dick Drott

347-48 is Nichols allright but I have big doubts on 351-52 being Mike Garman...Same for 335-36 not the looks of Jessie Reid and 341-42, seems much more like a '70s player while DeJesus pitched for the Phils in the 90s.... But can't bring a name for either these 3 players...

OH, and Merkle made a great search & find for us of Adey with an e

[SDL]

Originally Posted by Rainmaker

The Tuesday release for the Topps Vault was the least organized yet tasty assortment in a while. Almost like someone was pulling stuff out while blindfolded. We'll admit to a couple of these being educated guesses, but this is more of an attempt to move the debate forward.

Also featured is another couple of good photos of Dodgers minor leaguer Walter Aday, who was one of Merkle's Greatest Hits a couple of years ago.

It did wind up with some sharp, nice batting images for journeyman first baseman Mike Fiore with the Red Sox and Royals. It seemed like a rule that Topps had to run photos of him stretching for a throw, but it turns out they let him hold a bat as well.

Attachment 483158 Attachment 483159

FOLDER KE
321-322 Norm Larker; 323-324 Willard Schmidt; 325-326 Dick Drott; 327-328 Joe Cunningham; 329-330 Mario Guerrero; 331-332 Joe Orsulak;333-334 Ferguson Jenkins; 335-336 Jessie Reid; 337-338 Bert Blyleven; 339-340 Greg Shanahan; 341-342 Jose de Jesus; 343-344 Al Schroll; 345-346 Jose Pena; 347-348 Carl Nichols(?); 349-350 Walter Aday (Dodgers minor league); 351-352 Mike Garman(?); 353-354 Sal Maglie; 355-356 Duke Maas; 357-360 Mike Fiore.

Happy New Year/

No idea who 351-352 is, bit it is NOT Mike Garman.

[Rainmaker]

Originally Posted by keonleafs

ke321-22 is Don Taussig (Colts 45 1962) not Larker

ke325-26 is Seth Morehead not Dick Drott

347-48 is Nichols allright but I have big doubts on 351-52 being Mike Garman...Same for 335-36 not the looks of Jessie Reid and 341-42, seems much more like a '70s player while DeJesus pitched for the Phils in the 90s.... But can't bring a name for either these 3 players...

OH, and Merkle made a great search & find for us of Adey with an e

So much for my spitballing attempt. Much appreciated. After a day had passed, felt the need to put something together before we fell behind. Must have had Adey confused as a relative of Meat Loaf Aday. Tried to do facial rec on all of these, but that's mostly what I had to go by. My resources are limited.
But like I said, I wanted push the discussion forward. And thanks to you for doing it. I will immediately correct the OP to avoid confusion.

And thank you for the image cleanup! They jump off the page.

[Merkle923]

Don't spitball.

[Merkle923]

Never pitched in the major leagues, but merits a post here because his uploading by Topps as images KE 341 and 342 can be used to illustrate how to avoid things like the above train wreck.

Suter was primarily a Red Sox farmhand who went to the Phillies in the off-season of 1979-80. William Suter Minor Leagues Statistics & History | Baseball-Reference.com His identification was not the result of great detective work, just an effort more restrained than a wild guess.

From the two images we know the following facts: he was a righthand pitcher (remembering to check this will often protect the researcher from mistaking a left-hander - say, Seth Morehead - for a right-hander - say, Dick Drott), he was shown in spring training with the Phillies, and he's wearing uniform number 54.

There are a couple of other details we can stipulate are not facts, but likelihoods. The photography elements: uniform design, colors, location, sky conditions, etc., are consistent with Topps photography of Phillies from the 1972-1986. If you've seen enough of them on cards or just online the individual years begin to look familiar to you, and these images look to be in that late '70s early '80s cusp. Additionally, while the latest upload from Topps is all over the place alphabetically, the adjoining players are named Schroll and Shanahan, meaning there's a decent chance the player in question has a last name also beginning with "S."

So you should start your search looking for a right-handed pitcher who was in camp with the Phillies in the 1977-83 era, wore uniform number 54, and probably has a last name starting with "S." The Baseball-Reference.com site provides an annual list of all players in an organization in a given year, and you can rapidly advance from year to year and find possible candidates. If a fellow is a returned Rule V draftee or otherwise a transient within one franchise's farm system, you're stuck, but there are actually very few of them.

Just using that cold-search method, you're likely to produce less than ten candidates. If you do a google image search for each name you will, soon or late, come across a couple of TCMA cards of minor leaguer Burke Suter (misidentified as "Bill" on one; he was William Burke Suter) and you've found your man.

If you have greater resources available to you, like a collection of Street & Smith Annuals with their full 40-man spring training rosters, the process is a little quicker. You just look through them until you find a pitcher wearing 54 in the Phillies' roster. Wouldn't have worked if he had been a non-roster invitee, but there he is in the 1980 roster, so it's simple.

Either way, the process takes less time than does writing it up.

[SDL]

Originally Posted by Merkle923

Never pitched in the major leagues, but merits a post here because his uploading by Topps as images KE 341 and 342 can be used to illustrate how to avoid things like the above train wreck.

Suter was primarily a Red Sox farmhand who went to the Phillies in the off-season of 1979-80. William Suter Minor Leagues Statistics & History | Baseball-Reference.com His identification was not the result of great detective work, just an effort more restrained than a wild guess.

From the two images we know the following facts: he was a righthand pitcher (remembering to check this will often protect the researcher from mistaking a left-hander - say, Seth Morehead - for a right-hander - say, Dick Drott), he was shown in spring training with the Phillies, and he's wearing uniform number 54.

There are a couple of other details we can stipulate are not facts, but likelihoods. The photography elements: uniform design, colors, location, sky conditions, etc., are consistent with Topps photography of Phillies from the 1972-1986. If you've seen enough of them on cards or just online the individual years begin to look familiar to you, and these images look to be in that late '70s early '80s cusp. Additionally, while the latest upload from Topps is all over the place alphabetically, the adjoining players are named Schroll and Shanahan, meaning there's a decent chance the player in question has a last name also beginning with "S."

So you should start your search looking for a right-handed pitcher who was in camp with the Phillies in the 1977-83 era, wore uniform number 54, and probably has a last name starting with "S." The Baseball-Reference.com site provides an annual list of all players in an organization in a given year, and you can rapidly advance from year to year and find possible candidates. If a fellow is a returned Rule V draftee or otherwise a transient within one franchise's farm system, you're stuck, but there are actually very few of them.

Just using that cold-search method, you're likely to produce less than ten candidates. If you do a google image search for each name you will, soon or late, come across a couple of TCMA cards of minor leaguer Burke Suter (misidentified as "Bill" on one; he was William Burke Suter) and you've found your man.

If you have greater resources available to you, like a collection of Street & Smith Annuals with their full 40-man spring training rosters, the process is a little quicker. You just look through them until you find a pitcher wearing 54 in the Phillies' roster. Wouldn't have worked if he had been a non-roster invitee, but there he is in the 1980 roster, so it's simple.

Either way, the process takes less time than does writing it up.

I had thought he looked a bit familiar. I'd occasionally hit some PawSox games (I'm from the Boston area originally; Pawtucket was about an hour's drive or so from my house) and I DO remember seeing him pitch a few times.in '78 and '79. I'm surprised he wasn't called up to Fenway.

Now the $64,000 Question is....are there any TV shots of him still unreleased and in a Red Sox jersey?

[Merkle923]

For all the modern metrics, and the increasing interest in well-researched baseball history, one area that is lost in the folds of time is how team managements thought they stood at a given point. Only if you thumb through newspapers in February or March of 1962 do you get the sense that the New York Mets (and a lot of brass, and writers, in other cities) thought they had a pretty good ballclub - possibly a .500 team - entering into the season in which they would break all modern records for most losses.

Similarly, even after their implosion in September, 1964, the Phillies spent several years absolutely convinced they were only a player or two away from winning the pennant. Invariably those players were older (Dick Groat, Bill White, Larry Jackson, Bob Buhl, Pedro Ramos, Dick Hall, Turk Farrell - even guys released by other teams like Roger Craig).

This often damaging conviction (Jackson and Buhl cost them Ferguson Jenkins) may have reached its climax in 1967. As the Dexter image I posted earlier showed, the Phils brought Jim Gentile into camp even though he'd been traded or released three times in the preceding season-and-a-half (once, traded while tied for the lead in homers in the American League). They also invited Harvey Kuenn back even though he'd had exactly 14 extra base hits in the previous two seasons. Kuenn had the presence of mind to retire instead.

The Phils also brought in former Reds' ace Joey Jay even though he'd been traded and released in a six month span. They were convinced Jay would make the team and stuck his photo in a couple of publications. Even when Jay bombed out in the spring, they briefly assigned him to a A-ball. The number they saw was his chronological age (31) and not career innings (2056, majors and minors combined).

Not to go too deeply into the history lesson but 1967 was also the year the Phils gave another chance (11 AA starts) to 40-year old Robin Roberts, and stocked AAA with veterans dumped by other teams like Dick Bertell, Lou Clinton, Marty Keough, and Ed Roebuck.

Anyway, here's the first color shot I've ever seen of Jay during his ill-fated time with the '67 Phillies.

BTW message received on some of the requested Dexter images. I'm going to have another couple dozen processed at the pro shop and should have them back by mid-January, but I have to note at the top that Harris, Herrera, Owens, and Von Hoff are not among the Astros, Korince is not among the Tigers, Bench, Davidson and Osteen are not among the Reds, and Jake Wood would not be among the Reds since these are all from the spring and he didn't go to Cincinnati until June 23.

[baseball-birthdays.com]

Originally Posted by SPORTSMEM817

Digest: Ex-Patterson Park, Orioles pitcher Jim Lehew dies at 79 - Baltimore Sun

color image courtesy of keonleafs, b&w from the lexibell archives...

[cheech411]

merkle could u please tell me what teams U DONT HAVE IN DEXTER PRESS THANKS!!!!

[FatJack]

I hate to be a schnorrer, but, if there's a Sandy Alomar Mets with the Dexters, I'd love to see it. Light board would be fine; don't do the pro shop on my account.