A Fictional Player Responds

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

Is that usage tracker weighted by number of hours played? Or is just league formation stats? I ask because each version before I import my fictional league into the new version I test it out by loading up the MLB universe. Once I am satisfied that it is stable I convert my fictional league and never look at the MLB league again.

If you are only counting the number of times that a fictional league is formed and the number of times MLB id formed you're going to get skewed numbers. The opposite is true as well, I suppose. MLB/Historical guys may create test leagues.

Anyway I was just wondering how you came to those percentages.

It's number of games created. And I don't think those numbers are skewed in any way, they covers all types of users.

[JMDurron]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Please don't forget that we not only work on the new features! Almost every part of the game gets improvements, for example:

- Better in-game AI (pitching changes etc.)
- Batter player evaluation AI, impacting the AI throughout the game
- Better roster management AI
- Better draft AI
- Better trade AI
- Recoded scouting algorithm (young & unproven players are overrated more often, veterans scouted more accurately)
- Better player development (league remains more stable long-term in terms of overall player quality & stats output, more variance in development curves, "2 1/2-pitch pitchers" have a better chance to improve their 3rd pitch and become a true SP, etc.)

Also, we'll have plenty of little new features that have not been revealed yet.

These are absolutely the most important things to be worked on in every single release, regardless of what style of league any of us play.

I don't care whether I'm playing MLB Quickstart, Fictional, or Historical, when the AI plays someone with zero rating a 3B for no apparent reason, that messes with my head more than any lack of a new feature ever could. These are the things that will never sell more copies to the general public, but are what really separate OOTP from the rest of the gaming world. Those other companies might JUST pour all the effort into the new features, and even remove old ones (Madden Franchise Mode, anyone?), while OOTP keeps trying to make what is already in there better, on top of whatever new features are or are not included.

[OakDragon]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

Is that usage tracker weighted by number of hours played? Or is just league formation stats? I ask because each version before I import my fictional league into the new version I test it out by loading up the MLB universe. Once I am satisfied that it is stable I convert my fictional league and never look at the MLB league again.

If you are only counting the number of times that a fictional league is formed and the number of times MLB id formed you're going to get skewed numbers. The opposite is true as well, I suppose. MLB/Historical guys may create test leagues.

Anyway I was just wondering how you came to those percentages.

I do the same thing with fictional leagues, so we cancel each other out.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by jpeters1734

Oh I completely agree and I wasn't complaining btw. You guys do a great job and I promote the game at every opportunity

This x1000. My baseball friends have gotten tired of my OOTP evangelism. With two of them I finally made them a bet: I would pay for their copy if they didn't like it. Struck out with one and hit a homerun with the other (good news or bad news: you now have a real life newspaper editor playing OOTP).

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by JMDurron

These are absolutely the most important things to be worked on in every single release, regardless of what style of league any of us play.

I don't care whether I'm playing MLB Quickstart, Fictional, or Historical, when the AI plays someone with zero rating a 3B for no apparent reason, that messes with my head more than any lack of a new feature ever could. These are the things that will never sell more copies to the general public, but are what really separate OOTP from the rest of the gaming world. Those other companies might JUST pour all the effort into the new features, and even remove old ones (Madden Franchise Mode, anyone?), while OOTP keeps trying to make what is already in there better, on top of whatever new features are or are not included.

The game definitely needs to always insert the good-hands .200 BA utility infielder at 3B when the 3B goes down instead of a zero-rated .250 BA 1B, C, or RF.

[The Wolf]

HP: we chatted about test leagues here a few versions back, and it turns out that pretty much everybody does it.

[thriller13]

I pre-ordered just to support the continued development of this great game, I have no doubt there will be things discovered in 17 that will make it worth the upgrade but on the surface, just not overly excited.

the licensing - don't care, haven't played a league based on real teams since about OOTP 4

3D stadiums - still useless feature for fictional players

Facegen improvement - anything that helps to get immersed with my fictional players is good

Historical modes - haven't played much historical lately, but this is neat

Exhibition mode - i am sure i will use this at some point, truthfully can't believe this feature wasn't already in the game,

Mostly the faster sim speeds and team needs are the only features that kinda excite me though I have no doubt that once I am playing it there will be numerous little things that make it worth it.

What would excite me?

-more development of the associations so multiple leagues work together better and we could really push our imagination for new league ideas.
-understanding geography (so leagues could be created with "local" players", news reports would recognize geographic rivalries, sharing markets)
-more playoff formats or tournaments
-a complete redesign of rating system for players

I could probably come up with more if I gave it any real thought

[RchW]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

It's number of games created. And I don't think those numbers are skewed in any way, they covers all types of users.

Define a game created. My SOP is to import my fictional leagues from version to version. Is that a game created?

I create current and historical leagues in every version but rarely play them for more than a few hours due to lack of interest. So to some extent my data is skewed if it shows 2 fictional (imported as above) 1 current and 1 or 2 historical games created for a 95% fictional player.

Edit: this is not a complaint. I 100% support this franchise and completely understand the need to expand the scope of the market. This is one of the few times that the trickle down theory may work.

[OakDragon]

I would think that number of hours played would be a more reliable stat. Since it's already tracked, combining it with leagues created (i.e., # of hours per type) and capturing that would seem to me to be worthwhile.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by OakDragon

I would think that number of hours played would be a more reliable stat. Since it's already tracked, combining it with leagues created (i.e., # of hours per type) and capturing that would seem to me to be worthwhile.

It would not be. A few fanatics could drastically skew the results. The actual question is what kind of OOTP that customers play, not how many hours they spend playing it. Four thousand hours of OOTP 16 played by one diehard customer is exactly equivalent in sales volume and OOTP income to four hours total played by a casual customer.

[jpeters1734]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

It would not be. A few fanatics could drastically skew the results. The actual question is what kind of OOTP that customers play, not how many hours they spend play it. Four thousand hours of OOTP 16 played by one diehard customer is exactly equivalent in sales volume and OOTP income to four hours total played by a casual customer.

Fair point. There's also the fact that many users don't exit ootp when they're done

[swoboda]

There is no perfect way to accumulate the user data although I am sure there is a saber guy out there somewhere who would argue that point ! :-) )
I think OOTP does a really good job of trying to balance the needs of very different users. As I said in another thread , a lot of improvements help all of us no matter which mode we play, so there is a pretty good amount of common ground here.

Finally, I want OOTP to stay in business, so I am totally OK with OOTP "tilting" resources in the direction of where they can get the most revenue growth, even if it is not the mode I generally play.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by thriller13

What would excite me?

-more development of the associations so multiple leagues work together better and we could really push our imagination for new league ideas.

Associations could benefit historical league users as well. For example, instead of the having the AL and NL as subleagues under MLB, which necessitates averaging the real-life rules and stats for each league, the AL and NL could be leagues under an MLB association. This would allow the AL and NL to have individually set league stats totals, and any particular rules unique to each league could be recreated.

Originally Posted by thriller13

-understanding geography (so leagues could be created with "local" players", news reports would recognize geographic rivalries, sharing markets)

If your fictional league uses real-world locations, then that ought to be easily doable. Sharing markets is a much bigger issue, as that entails a major overhaul of OOTP's financial engine. (Such an overhaul would benefit current-day and historical league users as well. But it's a major undertaking, so it's not likely to be tackled any time soon. All I can say is that I have a wealth of real-life baseball financial data that can serve as reference.)

Originally Posted by thriller13

-more playoff formats or tournaments

This would also benefit current-day league users as well as historical league users. (OOTP still does not recreate the actual playoff formats used in the California and Midwest Leagues, for example.)

[The Wolf]

Markus just told us earlier today the changes to playoffs were a non-starter.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Markus just told us earlier today the changes to playoffs were a non-starter.

This year? Right. Next year? That's different.

The status quo has its warts and bumps, and for those users who place a premium on accuracy, it can be disappointing. OOTP at present cannot recreate the playoff formats of some of the leagues the game includes (that looks sloppy in that it presents an obvious inaccuracy), nor are the post-seasons for MLB historical leagues accurate in many cases either. (Inaccurate playoffs means the wrong clubs matching up, and/or playing on improper dates, and that surely affects pitcher usage, which in turn surely affects the legitimacy of OOTP's simulated results.)

[Déjà Bru]

Good responses, and what I expected from you if you were to respond:

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

They don't get lost. We have a small development team, and we're doing the best we can, which is trying to figure out how to appeal to the biggest possible customer base and at the same time try to please the hardcore user base. It's a thin line to walk.

Spread the word about OOTP, get all your friends to buy it. That will increase the revenue which allows us to invest in more developers, which in turn leads to more & better features.

Frankly, compared to big gaming companies like EA or Take2, the number of new features we hammer out each year is quite amazing, considering those guys have budgets 100 times bigger than ours.

No argument with this.

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

By the way, our usage tracker reveals that 65% of of OOTP users play the modern day MLB standard game, 25% fictional, and 10% historical.

Interesting stat. Makes me feel insecure. ()

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Please don't forget that we not only work on the new features! Almost every part of the game gets improvements, for example:

- Better in-game AI (pitching changes etc.)
- Better player evaluation AI, impacting the AI throughout the game
- Better roster management AI
- Better draft AI
- Better trade AI
- Recoded scouting algorithm (young & unproven players are overrated more often, veterans scouted more accurately)
- Better player development (league remains more stable long-term in terms of overall player quality & stats output, more variance in development curves, "2 1/2-pitch pitchers" have a better chance to improve their 3rd pitch and become a true SP, etc.)

Also, we'll have plenty of little new features that have not been revealed yet.

I hear you. I feel even better about pre-ordering anyway, despite my OP.