Usage shows that 65% play modern MLB, 25% fictional & 10% historical - Page 8

Lukas Berger · 02-26-2016, 11:07 PM

Great post! I love all three modes as well. Couldn't pick my favorite if you forced me to. This is the true beauty and the best thing about OOTP, whatever you want, it can fulfill your needs.

FM and other game are are incredible, no doubt, maybe even better than OOTP if you just look at what they primarily do, but nothing even comes close to matching OOTP's flexibility and versatility.

kq76 · 02-27-2016, 12:02 AM

The way I see it the results are more like 87% modern MLB, 13% historical MLB, and close to 100% fictional. Unless you're only running single seasons and not using any of the fictional settings, modern MLB is also fictional.

Also, what is this data actually based on? For example, in testing I create dozens of MLB leagues simply because it's easier to test a MLB league since I have an idea of what MLB should be like. I imagine most testers do the same. But do I really play any of these leagues as a user? No, none.

Lastly, if OOTP really made feature decisions solely based on what leagues are created, which I doubt they do, then that would be awfully short-sighted. That is, when a company wants to grow, should it simply look at getting more of the pie or should it also look at creating a bigger pie? Yes, it's difficult to know what to do to create a bigger pie, but one thing is for certain, just doing the same thing you're doing usually isn't the answer. Besides, it's always been my impression that Markus just goes with the next thing that catches his fancy, which often is a good idea anyway as fancies usually lead to new things.

The Wolf · 02-27-2016, 01:01 AM

More denial and rationalization.

Barkingturtle · 02-27-2016, 07:51 AM

More gloating over the fact you're now officially and provably part of the lowest common denominator. Typically folks don't spend time celebrating their pyrrhic victories this way, but I'm not here to tell the Wolf or anyone else anyone how to play the game of life(or electric baseball, for that matter).

The Wolf · 02-27-2016, 10:58 AM

No one's telling you how to play. But for years and years fictional players have behaved like a very entitled majority here and have made ridiculous requests (relegation/promotion, women's league's, etc.) and tried to steer the game to cater to fictional legues. Now the facts are out, and everyone knows fictional players are a badly outnumbered minority, and, yes, I am happy.

The Wolf · 02-27-2016, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkingturtle

the lowest common denominator

That is both a lie and an insult to the great majority of OOTP players. Fictional players aren't a bit better than any other players, despite what they seem to think.

OakDragon · 02-27-2016, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkingturtle

More gloating over the fact you're now officially and provably part of the lowest common denominator. Typically folks don't spend time celebrating their pyrrhic victories this way, but I'm not here to tell the Wolf or anyone else anyone how to play the game of life(or electric baseball, for that matter).

Just put him on your ignore list. When he came back, I thought I'd give him another chance. A couple of days was all I could take.

Barkingturtle · 02-27-2016, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf

That is both a lie and an insult to the great majority of OOTP players. Fictional players aren't a bit better than any other players, despite what they seem to think.

Evidence seems to indicate that people play MLB largely due to ease of set-up and player familiarity. This suggests that Vanilla MLB players lack certain traits which fictional players requisitely possess -- traits like creativity, imagination, patience, courage, hygiene, etc. Thus, lowest common denominator. Hey now, do not shoot the messenger, for he does not make the rules. I know it must painful to have the veil drawn back like this, but it is time to set aside your projection and accept that you are in fact the one suffering from denial and living in a fantasy-land. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm late for the first game of the Pan-Dimensional Baseball Classic. Today we'll match the Camelot Excaliburs against the Castle Greyskull Power to see who's got what it takes to claim the most prestigious award in the baseball multiverse.

cxs018 · 02-27-2016, 01:11 PM

In this moment, Barkingturtle is euphoric. Not because of any phony modern MLB game, but because he is enlightened by his creativity.

bababui · 02-27-2016, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf

More denial and rationalization.

Do you actually read and try to comprehend what people write or are you happy to simply troll?

How bout actually responding to the arguments of others.

Westheim · 02-27-2016, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bababui

Do you actually read and try to comprehend what people write or are you happy to simply troll?

How bout actually responding to the arguments of others.

Arguments brought forth by people other than him are always invalid. Invalid arguments need not be commented on. Instead he repeats the same thing he's stated before, with the obnoxiousness notched up a tick each time. I'd call that trolling. Besides, he's right anyway, don't you know?

Ugh, I gotta get outta here.

The Wolf · 02-27-2016, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bababui

Do you actually read and try to comprehend what people write or are you happy to simply troll?

How bout actually responding to the arguments of others.

That was a response. There was no argument, just denial and rationalization.

The shoe sure pinches when it's on the other foot, doesn't it?

endgame · 02-27-2016, 01:42 PM

Well....back to your corners.

FWIW, there's generally a seed of truth in all of the comments exchanged here, despite being delivered with vitriol. Back in the day- sorry for playing the longevity card

-the infamous Malleus Dei and I shared more than a few vigorous exchanges with differing viewpoints, but I never doubted once our respect for one another. I think that was mutual. Point being, as different kinds of players overall with very different skill sets, we were nearly always in agreement about one thing: get baseball (read that MLB) right first. In the final analysis, it will provide for a better game, whether it's fictional, modern, historical, etc...because a foundation of correct behavior and expectations will have been provided. What is built upon that or modified with settings is entirely up to the user, but essential to a framework is getting the RL model replicated as best we can, foregoing areas that do not make for good gameplay or amount to minutia. I think we were right then; I think it's still the valid impetus driving development overall, and believe, IMHO, we have made outstanding strides to arrive at the present model.

Call it anything you will, call each other anything you will. Frankly, the dysfunction can yield growth; conflict often does. A myriad number of exit ramps and various roads connect us, while we all begin at the same rest stop on the highway: a great game, modeled with a goal of statistical and creative integrity. We could do worse than modeling ourselves in kind.

The Wolf · 02-27-2016, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim

Arguments brought forth by people other than him are always invalid. Invalid arguments need not be commented on. Instead he repeats the same thing he's stated before, with the obnoxiousness notched up a tick each time. I'd call that trolling. Besides, he's right anyway, don't you know?

Ugh, I gotta get outta here.

Your insults are ridiculous. There is no argument: facts can't be argued against. The numbers are finally in, and the fictional side just wants to engage in insults, spin, denial and rationalization.

bababui · 02-27-2016, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf

That was a response. There was no argument, just denial and rationalization.

The shoe sure pinches when it's on the other foot, doesn't it?

Since the premise of your thesis is complete BS, its clear so is your conclusion.

For the learning impaired I will explain: The data is based on games started. Not games played. It includes games started so users can 1)see how MLB players are rated in the new game 2)so users can run quick test leagues in a familiar environment 3)data is only from users who allow OOTPD access to it.

It doesn't indicate what you think it does.

Matt Arnold · 02-27-2016, 01:53 PM

We love all our users, be they real or fictional.

Honorable_Pawn · 02-27-2016, 01:54 PM

See folks. That's how it's done.

You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

BrettC · 02-27-2016, 02:05 PM

What dumb arguments in here.

Both MLB and Fictional games work great, they will both continue to be worked on to improve and neither is being abandoned by anyone involved with the game.

The entire thread could be summed up by "Different strokes for different folks".

Honorable_Pawn · 02-27-2016, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrettC

What dumb arguments in here.

Both MLB and Fictional games work great, they will both continue to be worked on to improve and neither is being abandoned by anyone involved with the game.

The entire thread could be summed up by "Different strokes for different folks".

I think that it is time to lock this thread as the debate has devolved into mud-slinging. Nothing more constructive can be added, IMO. It has been thoroughly covered.

endgame · 02-27-2016, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

It has been thoroughly covered.

Mud does that.

02-27-2016, 12:02 AM	#142
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11,755	The way I see it the results are more like 87% modern MLB, 13% historical MLB, and close to 100% fictional. Unless you're only running single seasons and not using any of the fictional settings, modern MLB is also fictional. Also, what is this data actually based on? For example, in testing I create dozens of MLB leagues simply because it's easier to test a MLB league since I have an idea of what MLB should be like. I imagine most testers do the same. But do I really play any of these leagues as a user? No, none. Lastly, if OOTP really made feature decisions solely based on what leagues are created, which I doubt they do, then that would be awfully short-sighted. That is, when a company wants to grow, should it simply look at getting more of the pie or should it also look at creating a bigger pie? Yes, it's difficult to know what to do to create a bigger pie, but one thing is for certain, just doing the same thing you're doing usually isn't the answer. Besides, it's always been my impression that Markus just goes with the next thing that catches his fancy, which often is a good idea anyway as fancies usually lead to new things. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist \| My FAQ List OOTP Wiki \| Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project)

02-27-2016, 01:42 PM	#153
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	Well....back to your corners. FWIW, there's generally a seed of truth in all of the comments exchanged here, despite being delivered with vitriol. Back in the day- sorry for playing the longevity card -the infamous Malleus Dei and I shared more than a few vigorous exchanges with differing viewpoints, but I never doubted once our respect for one another. I think that was mutual. Point being, as different kinds of players overall with very different skill sets, we were nearly always in agreement about one thing: get baseball (read that MLB) right first. In the final analysis, it will provide for a better game, whether it's fictional, modern, historical, etc...because a foundation of correct behavior and expectations will have been provided. What is built upon that or modified with settings is entirely up to the user, but essential to a framework is getting the RL model replicated as best we can, foregoing areas that do not make for good gameplay or amount to minutia. I think we were right then; I think it's still the valid impetus driving development overall, and believe, IMHO, we have made outstanding strides to arrive at the present model. Call it anything you will, call each other anything you will. Frankly, the dysfunction can yield growth; conflict often does. A myriad number of exit ramps and various roads connect us, while we all begin at the same rest stop on the highway: a great game, modeled with a goal of statistical and creative integrity. We could do worse than modeling ourselves in kind. __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

02-27-2016, 01:54 PM	#157
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	See folks. That's how it's done. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar. __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

02-26-2016, 11:07 PM	#141
Lukas Berger OOTP Developments Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Nice, Côte d'Azur, France Posts: 21,357	Great post! I love all three modes as well. Couldn't pick my favorite if you forced me to. This is the true beauty and the best thing about OOTP, whatever you want, it can fulfill your needs. FM and other game are are incredible, no doubt, maybe even better than OOTP if you just look at what they primarily do, but nothing even comes close to matching OOTP's flexibility and versatility.

02-27-2016, 07:51 AM	#144
Barkingturtle Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 99	More gloating over the fact you're now officially and provably part of the lowest common denominator. Typically folks don't spend time celebrating their pyrrhic victories this way, but I'm not here to tell the Wolf or anyone else anyone how to play the game of life(or electric baseball, for that matter).

02-27-2016, 01:11 PM	#149
cxs018 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2016 Posts: 22	In this moment, Barkingturtle is euphoric. Not because of any phony modern MLB game, but because he is enlightened by his creativity.

02-27-2016, 01:53 PM	#156
Matt Arnold OOTP Developer Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Here and there Posts: 15,807	We love all our users, be they real or fictional.

02-27-2016, 02:05 PM	#158
BrettC Minors (Single A) Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Canada Posts: 86	What dumb arguments in here. Both MLB and Fictional games work great, they will both continue to be worked on to improve and neither is being abandoned by anyone involved with the game. The entire thread could be summed up by "Different strokes for different folks".