BZ 1878: Fails to Load at Opening Screen with Facegen Enabled

endgame · 08-03-2008, 01:01 AM

Patched to 9.1.6, but still experiencing the opening screen crash with facegen enabled. Looking for suggested next steps.

I first discussed my problems in this thread:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...available.html

Specifically, this post details what I see with Facegen enabled.
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...91-post20.html

Now last night, running 9.1.2, and after an email from Markus, I disabled Facegen, opened and closed a few times, reset my resolution, and re-enabled Facegen in Preferences and the game seemed to open and close without error. The only last addition I did was to add Bobble's Mood Icons, a favorite of mine over the smilies. I thought it was working well, but I may have just been lucky.

Patched today and the problem is still there, again, my post #20 above says it all. All the info I can gather quickly is below. The only information there that is not precise is the video driver. I updated that after I captured the info, and now for some reason I don't have the Information tab I had before to enable me to capture that info to file. *shrug*

In any event, that's the recap with more details - if you need them - in the thread and post referenced, more details below. I don't know much about Facegen troubleshooting modes 1 or 2 or if they can help me, but I'll be grateful for any advice. Let me know how I can best help you on this end to get my game (and faces) up and running. I won't rule out - if you determine it's purely a graphics issue, putting my nVidia FX5500 back into this PC, but as far as I'm told, it'd be a downgrade from the integrated graphics. You tell me.

Thanks in advance.

System Info
Intel Pentium Dual CPU
E2200 @ 2.20GHz
2.20 GHz, 1.98 GB of RAM
OS Name Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition
Version 5.1.2600 Service Pack 3 Build 2600
OS Manufacturer Microsoft Corporation
System Name THE-388A67836FD
System Manufacturer INTEL
System Model DG31PR
System Type X86-based PC
Processor x86 Family 6 Model 15 Stepping 13 GenuineIntel ~2199 Mhz
BIOS Version/Date Intel Corp. PRG3110H.86A.0047.2008.0227.1745, 2/27/2008
SMBIOS Version 2.4
Windows Directory C:\WINDOWS
System Directory C:\WINDOWS\system32
Boot Device \Device\HarddiskVolume3
Locale United States
Hardware Abstraction Layer Version = "5.1.2600.5512 (xpsp.080413-2111)"
User Name THE-388A67836FD\User
Time Zone Central Daylight Time
Total Physical Memory 2,048.00 MB
Available Physical Memory 1.30 GB
Total Virtual Memory 2.00 GB
Available Virtual Memory 1.96 GB
Page File Space 3.84 GB
Page File C:\pagefile.sys

Graphics Info
Intel(R) Graphics Media Accelerator Driver Report

Report Date: 08/02/2008
Report Time[hr:mm:ss]: 22:36:03
Driver Version: 6.14.10.4885
Operating System: Windows XP* Home Edition, Service Pack 3 (5.1.2600)
Default Language: English
DirectX* Version: 9.0
Physical Memory: 2035 MB
Minimum Graphics Memory: 8 MB
Maximum Graphics Memory: 128 MB
Graphics Memory in Use: 11 MB
Processor: x86 family 6 Model 15 Stepping 13
Processor Speed: 2199 MHZ
Vendor ID: 8086
Device ID: 29C2
Device Revision: 10

* Accelerator Information *
Accelerator in Use: Intel(R) G33/G31 Express Chipset Family
Video BIOS: 1508.0
Current Graphics Mode: 1280 by 1024 True Color (60 Hz)

* Devices Connected to the Graphics Accelerator *

Active Monitors: 1

* Monitor *
Monitor Name: Plug and Play Monitor
Display Type: Analog
Gamma Value: 2.20
DDC2 Protocol: Supported
Maximum Image Size: Horizontal: 14.0 inches
Vertical: 11.0 inches
Monitor Supported Modes:
640 by 480 (60 Hz)
640 by 480 (67 Hz)
640 by 480 (72 Hz)
640 by 480 (75 Hz)
720 by 400 (70 Hz)
800 by 600 (56 Hz)
800 by 600 (60 Hz)
800 by 600 (72 Hz)
800 by 600 (75 Hz)
832 by 624 (75 Hz)
1024 by 768 (60 Hz)
1024 by 768 (70 Hz)
1024 by 768 (75 Hz)
1152 by 864 (75 Hz)
1152 by 870 (75 Hz)
1280 by 1024 (60 Hz)
1280 by 1024 (75 Hz)
Display Power Management Support:
Standby Mode: Supported
Suspend Mode: Supported
Active Off Mode: Supported
Raw EDID:
00 ff ff ff ff ff ff 00 38 a3 69 66 01 01 01 01
02 0f 01 03 08 26 1e 78 ea 59 ce a4 58 4b 9f 24
13 4f 54 bf ef 80 71 4f 81 80 01 01 01 01 01 01
01 01 01 01 01 01 30 2a 00 98 51 00 2a 40 30 70
13 00 78 2d 11 00 00 1e 00 00 00 fd 00 38 4b 1f
51 0e 00 0a 20 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 fc 00 4c
43 44 39 32 56 0a 20 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 ff
00 35 31 31 31 33 31 32 39 4e 41 0a 20 20 00 ee

endgame · 08-03-2008, 01:44 AM

Update. Uninstalled, reinstalled. Game opened up without error to default resolution. Closed the game and reopened to ensure it would do so again without error.

Changed my preferences back to 1280x1024, exited the game, reopened without error. Again, don't know if it's a fluke, luck, or related to those doggone mood icons that I so want to use. I haven't put them back in and that's the only thing I can think of that is not restored to the original league settings in 9.1.2 and before. It has worked before with them, so I don't understand how they could be linked, but they've become suspect.

I did take note that the default moods are 16x16 and the replacement moods are 18x18. I can't see where that would have impact. Perhaps it's the fact that the skin has to be rebuilt (outside the game of course by deleting or renaming the skin.bin file in modern) that ultimately plays into the error? Don't know, but beyond any advice anyone has to offer here, I'm going to just try to live with the smilies for awhile and see if the game'll continue to perform without error. If it does, that might at least point to the idea that either the icons themselves or the rebuilding of the skin are players in the problem.

:hanging in there:

Again, thanks in advance.

Greatgrampa · 08-03-2008, 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endgame

Update. Uninstalled, reinstalled. Game opened up without error to default resolution. Closed the game and reopened to ensure it would do so again without error.

Changed my preferences back to 1280x1024, exited the game, reopened without error. Again, don't know if it's a fluke, luck, or related to those doggone mood icons that I so want to use. I haven't put them back in and that's the only thing I can think of that is not restored to the original league settings in 9.1.2 and before. It has worked before with them, so I don't understand how they could be linked, but they've become suspect.

I did take note that the default moods are 16x16 and the replacement moods are 18x18. I can't see where that would have impact. Perhaps it's the fact that the skin has to be rebuilt (outside the game of course by deleting or renaming the skin.bin file in modern) that ultimately plays into the error? Don't know, but beyond any advice anyone has to offer here, I'm going to just try to live with the smilies for awhile and see if the game'll continue to perform without error. If it does, that might at least point to the idea that either the icons themselves or the rebuilding of the skin are players in the problem.

:hanging in there:

Again, thanks in advance.

Well, the specs themselves don't indicate any problem but good that you put them on here. Do you have DirectX 9c? You put down just 9....if that is the case, go to Microsoft and get DirectX 9c. That would help some.
Most of the time though it is a software that is the problem, or as you say, the mood icons. Just because they work for others doesn't mean they can't cause problems on your computer. I would change the file sizes to 16x16 and try that. If that doesn't help then just get rid of those files. I know you like them but I think you like playing the sim better....yes?

Anyway, keep at it. You will find the answer eventually.

endgame · 08-03-2008, 01:30 PM

Thanks for the quick overview, ggpa. You encouraged me to give those areas my own look-see right away. Dxdiag shows that I am indeed running 9c, so check that one off. Good eye. Wouldn't have even thought about DirectX's influence. On to the next.

Noticed that my 'alternative' Bobble's mood icons were 16x16 (the Gloving Moods), so I copied and pasted those to the skin file for the test. Renamed skin.bin to oldskin.bin and gave it the whirl. No dice. Crash before opening screen. Hmmm.. Almost expected that.

Went back, grabbed the original files, wrote over the mood icons, deleted the skin.bin and renamed the oldskin back to the 'skin'. All good to go, opening screen arrived with no error.

At this point, unless your vast wisdom has another opinion, I still suspect the icon changes in conjunction with the skin rebuild. I guess the last test would be to rebuild the skin with NO changes made and see if that process, in itself, contains some step that will bog down the process.

Yes, I do want to use alternative icons. I should be able to do that if I choose. But....as you rightly stated, better to not have them and be able to play, than not. It just seems like such a little adjustment. Then, of course, I recall this is only Jan 02, and the draft hasn't even taken place yet because I've been so obsessed with finding out what causes this particular error since post-beta. I should probably just get on with the game and hope there is not a next error to distract or discourage me, eh?

Bobble · 08-04-2008, 08:03 AM

Anyone else having this problem? I haven't upgraded to the latest patch yet.

The only thing I can think of is if the color depth doesn't match between the mod and the original. I'll check that this evening. I can't imagine why it would change in this particular patch but that's really the only idea I have so far.

Bobble · 08-04-2008, 06:59 PM

I've looked at this tonight. I upgraded to 9.1.6 and tried to make 2 "new" skins, one a duplicate of OOTP Blue and one of OOTP Blue with the mood icons. Both worked fine. I'm not sure what else to do.

endgame · 08-04-2008, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobble

I've looked at this tonight. I upgraded to 9.1.6 and tried to make 2 "new" skins, one a duplicate of OOTP Blue and one of OOTP Blue with the mood icons. Both worked fine. I'm not sure what else to do.

Thanks, Bobble. Just so I'm clear on what you're saying. You made or modified new skins or made changes in them, and then deleted or renamed the old skin and let yours be the one rebuilt as the game loads?

Bobble · 08-05-2008, 08:57 AM

I didn't have it build the skin as the game loads. I switched to the new skin and then OOTP built it.

I DL'd the newest patch, installed it, and then had the game load on a skin where I already had the mood icons but I didn't have it do both things at once. Maybe try that: Load on a default skin and then switch to have it build a new one. After that, you should be able to load on a skin with the new skin since it's already been built.

endgame · 08-05-2008, 01:18 PM

Interesting. Maybe I'll try that, but I'm understandably nervous about all of it now.

Bobble · 08-05-2008, 02:17 PM

As I re-read my post, it was a verbal train wreck. I'm surprised you understood it.

Let me know how it goes for you.

endgame · 08-05-2008, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobble

I didn't have it build the skin as the game loads. I switched to the new skin and then OOTP built it.

I DL'd the newest patch, installed it, and then had the game load on a skin where I already had the mood icons but I didn't have it do both things at once. Maybe try that: Load on a default skin and then switch to have it build a new one. After that, you should be able to load on a skin with the new skin since it's already been built.

Well, gave it a try based on what I thought I read in your post. Crash. So, if you'd be inclined, I'm willing to make one last try at this to obtain those icons. **It'd be nice if in the next version, Markus included them!*

If all else fails, I'll copy Paul on this thread and see if he has any ideas on what the hold up could be. But on your part, could - as if you were giving a 10yr old instructions - you post step by step how you are loading the icons into your game?

I tried a variety of methods and none have worked. I'll spare you all those details. But, if you have the patience, I'll give it a whirl again. Just finished uninstalling and reinstalling after I did what I thought was the simplest of changes (even changed it back to original and it didn't work anymore!) as is was my only resort. So, if you don't mind. I'm listening. Thanks, Bobble.

pisdpaul · 08-06-2008, 05:17 AM

Hi,

Right this is very confusing. Can I clear up a few simple things first..

* If you rebuild the skin by deleting skin.bin without changing anything else does the crash occur?

* can you give me a link to the icons you are using so I can check them out

* does the crash only occur with facegen selected?

* what do you see just before/during the crash? Whats on the screen at the time? If its the stop watch how long has it be up and is it still spinning?

Just so that you know DirectX is not used by OOTP for grpahics. It is only used for Sound. This basic window uses standard windows API and the facegen 3d uses OpenGL which is better supported on Mac/Linux.

endgame · 08-06-2008, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pisdpaul

Right this is very confusing. Can I clear up a few simple things first..

* If you rebuild the skin by deleting skin.bin without changing anything else does the crash occur?

I can test this again, but I've tried nearly every variation. I want to say the answer to this is a 'sometimes', but not often (if at all). I will add that I have altered the skin, rebuilt it (through renaming), had it error, replaced all back to original and still had it error, though not every time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pisdpaul

* can you give me a link to the icons you are using so I can check them out

http://www.jazzrack.us/mods/ootpmods...moodthumbs.zip

Quote:

Originally Posted by pisdpaul

* does the crash only occur with facegen selected?

The crashes have always been with facegen selected. I was able, once, to change preferences back to 1280x1024 and enable facegen within the game after a crash-flag screen and have it load back up successfully, and this included the new mood icons. This was an isolated and single incident.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pisdpaul

* what do you see just before/during the crash? Whats on the screen at the time? If its the stop watch how long has it be up and is it still spinning?

This post http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...91-post20.html has the pic that I always see: the opening screen options with the ball at the bottom. All of the times I can remember, it spins for a while, 10 seconds low range / 25 seconds or more at the high range, does stop - to the best of my recollection - and then gives the OOTP Must Close error.

Thanks SO much for your input on this, Paul. I know your time is valuable.

pisdpaul · 08-07-2008, 11:39 AM

Ok, from what you say about the spinning ball being on screen for around 10 seconds it sounds like its the face gen initialization function thats crashing. This ties in with the crash only happening with facegen turned on. Because it does not always behave the same it tells me it is either a dangling ptr or uninitialized memory. These are the worst kind of bugs to find

I have checked out the mood icons and they are fine. I am guessing that they cause memory to aligned differently on skin load, thereby affecting this bug. This hints to be its a memory/ptr issue. If you look at the right window on your screen shot it is crashing inside "ntdll.dll" which is the main windows system DLL. This means the crash is being caused by duff memory being passed into a windows API function. This could be either because the argument passed in is wrong or the program stack has been trashed by an earlier error.

You have given me some very important information on what this bug is, however I am unable to continue looking into this and need to defer it to Andreas. The main reason for this is that I work exclusively on Linux which currently does not have facegen working. Also it looks to be related to the window API functions calls which need debugging on windows. It would take me days to debug this inside a windows emulator. Given all your info above, Andreas may well be able to find it by starting in .net with memory checking turned on in a fraction of the time

I will however keep an eye on this as I am very intrigued to see what the problem is.

This is not over...

Nutlaw · 08-17-2008, 02:07 PM

Well, I went and logged this as BZ 1878. Addressed to Andreas with endgame and Paul copied.

endgame · 08-17-2008, 06:49 PM

Thanks, nut. While the problem hasn't been eliminated, it has yet to prohibit me from playing the game at all, just playing it consistently with confidence. It's too good to abandon. I'd rather play on crutches than not at all.

Thanks, again.

Nutlaw · 09-30-2008, 08:07 PM

This issue has been claimed fixed for the upcoming patch (post 9.1.6). If after installing it you still see this behavior, please post in Tech Support. Thanks.

08-03-2008, 01:01 AM	#1
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	BZ 1878: Fails to Load at Opening Screen with Facegen Enabled Patched to 9.1.6, but still experiencing the opening screen crash with facegen enabled. Looking for suggested next steps. I first discussed my problems in this thread: http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...available.html Specifically, this post details what I see with Facegen enabled. http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...91-post20.html Now last night, running 9.1.2, and after an email from Markus, I disabled Facegen, opened and closed a few times, reset my resolution, and re-enabled Facegen in Preferences and the game seemed to open and close without error. The only last addition I did was to add Bobble's Mood Icons, a favorite of mine over the smilies. I thought it was working well, but I may have just been lucky. Patched today and the problem is still there, again, my post #20 above says it all. All the info I can gather quickly is below. The only information there that is not precise is the video driver. I updated that after I captured the info, and now for some reason I don't have the Information tab I had before to enable me to capture that info to file. shrug In any event, that's the recap with more details - if you need them - in the thread and post referenced, more details below. I don't know much about Facegen troubleshooting modes 1 or 2 or if they can help me, but I'll be grateful for any advice. Let me know how I can best help you on this end to get my game (and faces) up and running. I won't rule out - if you determine it's purely a graphics issue, putting my nVidia FX5500 back into this PC, but as far as I'm told, it'd be a downgrade from the integrated graphics. You tell me. Thanks in advance. System Info Intel Pentium Dual CPU E2200 @ 2.20GHz 2.20 GHz, 1.98 GB of RAM OS Name Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition Version 5.1.2600 Service Pack 3 Build 2600 OS Manufacturer Microsoft Corporation System Name THE-388A67836FD System Manufacturer INTEL System Model DG31PR System Type X86-based PC Processor x86 Family 6 Model 15 Stepping 13 GenuineIntel ~2199 Mhz BIOS Version/Date Intel Corp. PRG3110H.86A.0047.2008.0227.1745, 2/27/2008 SMBIOS Version 2.4 Windows Directory C:\WINDOWS System Directory C:\WINDOWS\system32 Boot Device \Device\HarddiskVolume3 Locale United States Hardware Abstraction Layer Version = "5.1.2600.5512 (xpsp.080413-2111)" User Name THE-388A67836FD\User Time Zone Central Daylight Time Total Physical Memory 2,048.00 MB Available Physical Memory 1.30 GB Total Virtual Memory 2.00 GB Available Virtual Memory 1.96 GB Page File Space 3.84 GB Page File C:\pagefile.sys Graphics Info Intel(R) Graphics Media Accelerator Driver Report Report Date: 08/02/2008 Report Time[hr:mm:ss]: 22:36:03 Driver Version: 6.14.10.4885 Operating System: Windows XP* Home Edition, Service Pack 3 (5.1.2600) Default Language: English DirectX* Version: 9.0 Physical Memory: 2035 MB Minimum Graphics Memory: 8 MB Maximum Graphics Memory: 128 MB Graphics Memory in Use: 11 MB Processor: x86 family 6 Model 15 Stepping 13 Processor Speed: 2199 MHZ Vendor ID: 8086 Device ID: 29C2 Device Revision: 10 * Accelerator Information * Accelerator in Use: Intel(R) G33/G31 Express Chipset Family Video BIOS: 1508.0 Current Graphics Mode: 1280 by 1024 True Color (60 Hz) * Devices Connected to the Graphics Accelerator * Active Monitors: 1 * Monitor * Monitor Name: Plug and Play Monitor Display Type: Analog Gamma Value: 2.20 DDC2 Protocol: Supported Maximum Image Size: Horizontal: 14.0 inches Vertical: 11.0 inches Monitor Supported Modes: 640 by 480 (60 Hz) 640 by 480 (67 Hz) 640 by 480 (72 Hz) 640 by 480 (75 Hz) 720 by 400 (70 Hz) 800 by 600 (56 Hz) 800 by 600 (60 Hz) 800 by 600 (72 Hz) 800 by 600 (75 Hz) 832 by 624 (75 Hz) 1024 by 768 (60 Hz) 1024 by 768 (70 Hz) 1024 by 768 (75 Hz) 1152 by 864 (75 Hz) 1152 by 870 (75 Hz) 1280 by 1024 (60 Hz) 1280 by 1024 (75 Hz) Display Power Management Support: Standby Mode: Supported Suspend Mode: Supported Active Off Mode: Supported Raw EDID: 00 ff ff ff ff ff ff 00 38 a3 69 66 01 01 01 01 02 0f 01 03 08 26 1e 78 ea 59 ce a4 58 4b 9f 24 13 4f 54 bf ef 80 71 4f 81 80 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 30 2a 00 98 51 00 2a 40 30 70 13 00 78 2d 11 00 00 1e 00 00 00 fd 00 38 4b 1f 51 0e 00 0a 20 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 fc 00 4c 43 44 39 32 56 0a 20 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 ff 00 35 31 31 31 33 31 32 39 4e 41 0a 20 20 00 ee __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

08-03-2008, 01:30 PM	#4
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	Thanks for the quick overview, ggpa. You encouraged me to give those areas my own look-see right away. Dxdiag shows that I am indeed running 9c, so check that one off. Good eye. Wouldn't have even thought about DirectX's influence. On to the next. Noticed that my 'alternative' Bobble's mood icons were 16x16 (the Gloving Moods), so I copied and pasted those to the skin file for the test. Renamed skin.bin to oldskin.bin and gave it the whirl. No dice. Crash before opening screen. Hmmm.. Almost expected that. Went back, grabbed the original files, wrote over the mood icons, deleted the skin.bin and renamed the oldskin back to the 'skin'. All good to go, opening screen arrived with no error. At this point, unless your vast wisdom has another opinion, I still suspect the icon changes in conjunction with the skin rebuild. I guess the last test would be to rebuild the skin with NO changes made and see if that process, in itself, contains some step that will bog down the process. Yes, I do want to use alternative icons. I should be able to do that if I choose. But....as you rightly stated, better to not have them and be able to play, than not. It just seems like such a little adjustment. Then, of course, I recall this is only Jan 02, and the draft hasn't even taken place yet because I've been so obsessed with finding out what causes this particular error since post-beta. I should probably just get on with the game and hope there is not a next error to distract or discourage me, eh? __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

08-04-2008, 08:03 AM	#5
Bobble Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: High and outside Posts: 3,897	Anyone else having this problem? I haven't upgraded to the latest patch yet. The only thing I can think of is if the color depth doesn't match between the mod and the original. I'll check that this evening. I can't imagine why it would change in this particular patch but that's really the only idea I have so far. __________________

08-04-2008, 06:59 PM	#6
Bobble Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: High and outside Posts: 3,897	I've looked at this tonight. I upgraded to 9.1.6 and tried to make 2 "new" skins, one a duplicate of OOTP Blue and one of OOTP Blue with the mood icons. Both worked fine. I'm not sure what else to do. __________________

08-05-2008, 08:57 AM	#8
Bobble Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: High and outside Posts: 3,897	I didn't have it build the skin as the game loads. I switched to the new skin and then OOTP built it. I DL'd the newest patch, installed it, and then had the game load on a skin where I already had the mood icons but I didn't have it do both things at once. Maybe try that: Load on a default skin and then switch to have it build a new one. After that, you should be able to load on a skin with the new skin since it's already been built. __________________

08-03-2008, 01:44 AM	#2
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	Update. Uninstalled, reinstalled. Game opened up without error to default resolution. Closed the game and reopened to ensure it would do so again without error. Changed my preferences back to 1280x1024, exited the game, reopened without error. Again, don't know if it's a fluke, luck, or related to those doggone mood icons that I so want to use. I haven't put them back in and that's the only thing I can think of that is not restored to the original league settings in 9.1.2 and before. It has worked before with them, so I don't understand how they could be linked, but they've become suspect. I did take note that the default moods are 16x16 and the replacement moods are 18x18. I can't see where that would have impact. Perhaps it's the fact that the skin has to be rebuilt (outside the game of course by deleting or renaming the skin.bin file in modern) that ultimately plays into the error? Don't know, but beyond any advice anyone has to offer here, I'm going to just try to live with the smilies for awhile and see if the game'll continue to perform without error. If it does, that might at least point to the idea that either the icons themselves or the rebuilding of the skin are players in the problem. :hanging in there: Again, thanks in advance. __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

08-05-2008, 01:18 PM	#9
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	Interesting. Maybe I'll try that, but I'm understandably nervous about all of it now. __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

08-05-2008, 02:17 PM	#10
Bobble Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: High and outside Posts: 3,897	As I re-read my post, it was a verbal train wreck. I'm surprised you understood it. Let me know how it goes for you. __________________

08-06-2008, 05:17 AM	#12
pisdpaul Developer PISD & OOTP Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,207	Hi, Right this is very confusing. Can I clear up a few simple things first.. * If you rebuild the skin by deleting skin.bin without changing anything else does the crash occur? * can you give me a link to the icons you are using so I can check them out * does the crash only occur with facegen selected? * what do you see just before/during the crash? Whats on the screen at the time? If its the stop watch how long has it be up and is it still spinning? Just so that you know DirectX is not used by OOTP for grpahics. It is only used for Sound. This basic window uses standard windows API and the facegen 3d uses OpenGL which is better supported on Mac/Linux.

08-07-2008, 11:39 AM	#14
pisdpaul Developer PISD & OOTP Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,207	Ok, from what you say about the spinning ball being on screen for around 10 seconds it sounds like its the face gen initialization function thats crashing. This ties in with the crash only happening with facegen turned on. Because it does not always behave the same it tells me it is either a dangling ptr or uninitialized memory. These are the worst kind of bugs to find I have checked out the mood icons and they are fine. I am guessing that they cause memory to aligned differently on skin load, thereby affecting this bug. This hints to be its a memory/ptr issue. If you look at the right window on your screen shot it is crashing inside "ntdll.dll" which is the main windows system DLL. This means the crash is being caused by duff memory being passed into a windows API function. This could be either because the argument passed in is wrong or the program stack has been trashed by an earlier error. You have given me some very important information on what this bug is, however I am unable to continue looking into this and need to defer it to Andreas. The main reason for this is that I work exclusively on Linux which currently does not have facegen working. Also it looks to be related to the window API functions calls which need debugging on windows. It would take me days to debug this inside a windows emulator. Given all your info above, Andreas may well be able to find it by starting in .net with memory checking turned on in a fraction of the time I will however keep an eye on this as I am very intrigued to see what the problem is. This is not over...

08-17-2008, 02:07 PM	#15
Nutlaw Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 9,538	Well, I went and logged this as BZ 1878. Addressed to Andreas with endgame and Paul copied.

08-17-2008, 06:49 PM	#16
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	Thanks, nut. While the problem hasn't been eliminated, it has yet to prohibit me from playing the game at all, just playing it consistently with confidence. It's too good to abandon. I'd rather play on crutches than not at all. Thanks, again. __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

09-30-2008, 08:07 PM	#17
Nutlaw Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 9,538	This issue has been claimed fixed for the upcoming patch (post 9.1.6). If after installing it you still see this behavior, please post in Tech Support. Thanks.