Markus, would it be possible...

actionjackson · 04-02-2016, 08:05 PM

...To give us more control over rosters and lineups in historical exhibition mode? I ask because I usually tinker a bit with the rosters, but doing so results in strange happenings with the lineups. For example, 1) 1998 Braves - sometimes I'll go to the start page and the rotation is Maddux, Smoltz, Millwood, Neagle with Cy Young winner Tom Glavine in the bullpen. Other times it doesn't do this and Neagle is in the bullpen with Glavine in the rotation. 2) Every time I go to the rosters and go immediately to "Play Ball!" and push "Play" it will start Tony Graffanino at SS over Walt Weiss which doesn't begin to make sense especially if you bring ratings into it. 3) If I bring up Greg Colbrunn (great bat to have off the bench), he will start at 1B instead of Andres Galarraga, with Klesko in LF. Again...Does not make sense. 4) If I drop LF Damon Hollins from the 25-man roster because it doesn't make any sense at all to have him on the roster, Klesko becomes a 1B, and starts in place of Galarraga, while Curtis Pride starts in LF. Not even in a drunken stupor would Bobby Cox start Curtis Pride over Andres Galarraga all things being equal (I have injuries off).

I also did some roster massaging with the 1954 Yankees in order to bring up Johnny Sain and Tom A Gorman for bullpen help. I believe I sent down Bobby W Brown and Jerry Coleman. Suddenly Bob Cerv was starting in CF over you know who...Yeah...The Mick. Casey Stengel may have been "colourful" but I don't think he would ever do this.

1975 Reds, I did some roster massaging (don't recall what but it involved sending down position players in order to get up bullpen pieces) and suddenly Dan Driessen was starting at 3B over Pete Rose. I know Sparky loved to keep his relievers guessing, but I don't think he would've done this for one second.

I love, love, love this new feature, but as these examples show it needs some tweaking. The problem is the rosters will always need to be tweaked because somebody (or more than one somebody) will be on the 25-man that shouldn't be there, and somebody (or again more than one somebody) will be on the Reserve Roster who should be on the 25-man. Once the tinkering is done funny things begin to happen to the lineups, although sometimes roster tinkering is not required for funny things to happen with the lineup as the Graffanino/Weiss example above shows. I know you love this feature too...It just needs a little help, as is to be expected because it is so new.

Thank you very much for it. I wasn't sure I would use it when it was announced, and then when I got the game, I built a 64-team NCAA basketball style tournament with it which has been a blast so far.

Orcin · 04-02-2016, 08:21 PM

I have the same problem with this feature. I want more control over the lineups and pitching rotation. Even after I correct the rotation, it doesn't stick. I have to go in before every game and change lineups and positions. If a starter is labeled as a reliever, he won't be able to go as deep into the game - so it matters.

kq76 · 04-02-2016, 08:22 PM

So by more control are you asking for forced starts and/or series starting lineups?

As for the active vs. reserve roster issues, I think this would help.

I agree, it's a great feature, but there are some pretty severe problems with it (comparing eras is another) when you want to take it seriously.

actionjackson · 04-02-2016, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orcin

I have the same problem with this feature. I want more control over the lineups and pitching rotation. Even after I correct the rotation, it doesn't stick. I have to go in before every game and change lineups and positions. If a starter is labeled as a reliever, he won't be able to go as deep into the game - so it matters.

How do you change lineups and positions? I'd do that if I could figure it out. I went in and changed it to my control, adjusted the lineups to my taste, switched control back to AI because I don't want to actually manage the game (I just want some control over the lineups to stop the silliness from happening), and when the game started all my changes got overwritten.

Orcin · 04-03-2016, 12:34 AM

Exit the game and reload it via the load game function (your save is called HistoricalExhibition). You can use all of the game menus and do what you want. However, it only lasts until you advance the game day. I was able to set myself to control lineups and it worked for the game at hand.

P.S. Try starting the game as manager. After the game begins, just sim to the end of the game. The AI will take over and manage the game. It takes a little longer than pushing the quick play button but you do get to set the lineups.

Dutch Alexander · 04-03-2016, 04:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionjackson

How do you change lineups and positions? I'd do that if I could figure it out. I went in and changed it to my control, adjusted the lineups to my taste, switched control back to AI because I don't want to actually manage the game (I just want some control over the lineups to stop the silliness from happening), and when the game started all my changes got overwritten.

Do what Orcin says but before loading the HistoricalExhibition give it a new name first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orcin

Exit the game and reload it via the load game function (your save is called HistoricalExhibition). You can use all of the game menus and do what you want. However, it only lasts until you advance the game day. I was able to set myself to control lineups and it worked for the game at hand.

Go to each teams home page, go to HOME ---> SETTINGS and select the check box "Prevent any AI roster changes". Now you can change each teams roster, lineups and pitching staff according to historical use and these changes will not be overwritten.

I also change the schedule according to historical dates, then advance to the game 1 date and then save it as a quickstart. Now I can replay this World Series with accurate rosters, lineups and pitching staff as many times as I like using the quickstart.

Markus Heinsohn · 04-03-2016, 05:09 AM

Well, right now the AI is in control and if you want changes, you need to manually edit things prior to each game. Adding more control would be a lot of work and something for OOTP 18 I suppose.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kq76

So by more control are you asking for forced starts and/or series starting lineups?

As for the active vs. reserve roster issues, I think this would help.

I agree, it's a great feature, but there are some pretty severe problems with it (comparing eras is another) when you want to take it seriously.

Comparing eras works exactly as designed and intended, I see absolutely no issues here.

kq76 · 04-03-2016, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Comparing eras works exactly as designed and intended, I see absolutely no issues here.

*facepalm*

Okay, well let's just assume that, in actuality, everything's okay, that there is a level-playing field. The perception by some is that it's not. See for yourself, from your own video announcing the 16 in '16 tournament (7:47 to about 9:37), both announcers are stating their worry that there might be a problem with it. It doesn't matter whether the reality is that there is a problem or not, the perception that there might be, or even probably is, a problem is definitely there.

And you know what, there's a really simple solution to this problem: just have an option for eras to be set according to the home team. Boom, done, no more problem perceived or in actuality. Sure, whoever has home field advantage still has an advantage, but it's only a slight one as a lot of series won't go to the final game and at least you tried to solve the problem.

Markus Heinsohn · 04-03-2016, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kq76

*facepalm*

Okay, well let's just assume that, in actuality, everything's okay, that there is a level-playing field. The perception by some is that it's not. See for yourself, from your own video announcing the 16 in '16 tournament (7:47 to about 9:37), both announcers are stating their worry that there might be a problem with it. It doesn't matter whether the reality is that there is a problem or not, the perception that there might be, or even probably is, a problem is definitely there.

And you know what, there's a really simple solution to this problem: just have an option for eras to be set according to the home team. Boom, done, no more problem perceived or in actuality. Sure, whoever has home field advantage still has an advantage, but it's only a slight one as a lot of series won't go to the final game and at least you tried to solve the problem.

The problem is that this is not easily possible. All player ratings, strategy settings etc. would have to be recalculated prior to home-field change. Right now, you choose the era and everything is neutralized toward that. I see no problem here, it creates a level playing field, with either both teams playing in era A or B or a neutral modern one.

What's with the video? They did not mention a problem as far as I can hear... also they got it wrong. If you play a 1902 team in the 1996 era, a player who hit 20% more HR than league average in 1902 will get ratings that equals 20% more HR than league average in 1996. So instead of 4 HR we will hit something like 24 or so.

Anyway, doing alternating eras for homefields will make it into the game some day, but it's not trivial to code, I can tell you that

04-02-2016, 08:05 PM	#1
actionjackson Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 6,163	Markus, would it be possible... ...To give us more control over rosters and lineups in historical exhibition mode? I ask because I usually tinker a bit with the rosters, but doing so results in strange happenings with the lineups. For example, 1) 1998 Braves - sometimes I'll go to the start page and the rotation is Maddux, Smoltz, Millwood, Neagle with Cy Young winner Tom Glavine in the bullpen. Other times it doesn't do this and Neagle is in the bullpen with Glavine in the rotation. 2) Every time I go to the rosters and go immediately to "Play Ball!" and push "Play" it will start Tony Graffanino at SS over Walt Weiss which doesn't begin to make sense especially if you bring ratings into it. 3) If I bring up Greg Colbrunn (great bat to have off the bench), he will start at 1B instead of Andres Galarraga, with Klesko in LF. Again...Does not make sense. 4) If I drop LF Damon Hollins from the 25-man roster because it doesn't make any sense at all to have him on the roster, Klesko becomes a 1B, and starts in place of Galarraga, while Curtis Pride starts in LF. Not even in a drunken stupor would Bobby Cox start Curtis Pride over Andres Galarraga all things being equal (I have injuries off). I also did some roster massaging with the 1954 Yankees in order to bring up Johnny Sain and Tom A Gorman for bullpen help. I believe I sent down Bobby W Brown and Jerry Coleman. Suddenly Bob Cerv was starting in CF over you know who...Yeah...The Mick. Casey Stengel may have been "colourful" but I don't think he would ever do this. 1975 Reds, I did some roster massaging (don't recall what but it involved sending down position players in order to get up bullpen pieces) and suddenly Dan Driessen was starting at 3B over Pete Rose. I know Sparky loved to keep his relievers guessing, but I don't think he would've done this for one second. I love, love, love this new feature, but as these examples show it needs some tweaking. The problem is the rosters will always need to be tweaked because somebody (or more than one somebody) will be on the 25-man that shouldn't be there, and somebody (or again more than one somebody) will be on the Reserve Roster who should be on the 25-man. Once the tinkering is done funny things begin to happen to the lineups, although sometimes roster tinkering is not required for funny things to happen with the lineup as the Graffanino/Weiss example above shows. I know you love this feature too...It just needs a little help, as is to be expected because it is so new. Thank you very much for it. I wasn't sure I would use it when it was announced, and then when I got the game, I built a 64-team NCAA basketball style tournament with it which has been a blast so far. Last edited by actionjackson; 04-02-2016 at 08:08 PM.

04-02-2016, 08:22 PM	#3
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11,755	So by more control are you asking for forced starts and/or series starting lineups? As for the active vs. reserve roster issues, I think this would help. I agree, it's a great feature, but there are some pretty severe problems with it (comparing eras is another) when you want to take it seriously. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist \| My FAQ List OOTP Wiki \| Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project) Last edited by kq76; 04-02-2016 at 08:39 PM. Reason: added 2nd link, mainly for Markus

04-03-2016, 12:34 AM	#5
Orcin Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 9,849	Exit the game and reload it via the load game function (your save is called HistoricalExhibition). You can use all of the game menus and do what you want. However, it only lasts until you advance the game day. I was able to set myself to control lineups and it worked for the game at hand. P.S. Try starting the game as manager. After the game begins, just sim to the end of the game. The AI will take over and manage the game. It takes a little longer than pushing the quick play button but you do get to set the lineups. Last edited by Orcin; 04-03-2016 at 12:36 AM.

04-02-2016, 08:21 PM	#2
Orcin Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 9,849	I have the same problem with this feature. I want more control over the lineups and pitching rotation. Even after I correct the rotation, it doesn't stick. I have to go in before every game and change lineups and positions. If a starter is labeled as a reliever, he won't be able to go as deep into the game - so it matters.