Blown save calculation

heyctg · 04-05-2018, 02:24 PM

Hi, been playing for years. I have noticed a lot of blown saves I think are incorrect, and often after 4 innings where it is not a save situation. SP goes 4, has the lead next pitcher gives up the lead and in the stat line it is BS. 4 innings for a SP isn't a W situation so I think the stat is wrong. Has this been documented?

Rain King · 04-05-2018, 03:02 PM

Blown Saves are given in essentially any situation where a pitcher would have earned either a Hold or a Save (so in simplest terms, if they enter a game with a 1-3 run lead and give the lead up). Do you have an example of one you do not believe should have been issued?

heyctg · 04-05-2018, 03:12 PM

So it is intended a blown Hold, which is what I am seeing after 4 innings of a starter with the lead and then the reliever gives that lead up, is recorded as a blown save?

Is that a game design decision? my understanding is blown save is specific to a save situation

slugga27 · 04-05-2018, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heyctg

So it is intended a blown Hold, which is what I am seeing after 4 innings of a starter with the lead and then the reliever gives that lead up, is recorded as a blown save?

Is that a game design decision? my understanding is blown save is specific to a save situation

A blown save is defined as entering a game with a 1-3 run lead (or 4 or 5, in certain instances). (There is also the three-inning rule, but that isn't relevant to this conversation.) If a reliever enters an 8-6 lead in the 5th inning and gives up the lead, then that would be a blown save.

EDIT: This is not an OOTP rule. This is how blown saves are calculated IRL.

heyctg · 04-05-2018, 05:55 PM

So i guess this doesn;t really belong in a bug category based on the feedback, but offical MLB rules on what is a save are:

For a save opportunity, a pitcher must be the final pitcher for his team (and not the winning pitcher) and do one of the following:

Enter the game with a lead of no more than three runs and pitch at least one inning.
Enter the game with the tying run in the on-deck circle -- or closer to scoring.
Pitch at least three innings.

which is how I always understood it, the key being final pitcher..So a reliever who comes in after a SP goes 4 innings and gives up the lead doesn't Blow a save unless he's the last pitcher. That's not what is occuring

So if I wasn't clear, I'm seeing multiple BS stats for one team in a game at times, The situation i mention and then a true blown save when the last picther fails a save oppurtunity as outlined above.

heyctg · 04-05-2018, 06:56 PM

ATLANTA PITCHING LINESCORE CINCINNATI PITCHING LINESCORE
Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA
S. Newcomb 5.0 5 5 5 2 5 2 87 54 9.90
M. Cabrera BS (2) 1.0 2 1 1 0 1 0 19 14 3.86
R. Brothers 1.0 0 0 0 0 1 0 15 10 0.60
A. Minter W (1-2) 1.0 0 0 0 2 2 0 23 11 5.11
A. Vizcaino SV (1) 1.0 0 0 0 1 2 0 26 14 2.84

This is an example from my season, Cabrera should not have a BS if he is not the final pitcher - he pitched the 5th inning and gave up the lead blowing a hold

I see from an internet search there is debate on this issue outside of OOTP. So I'll subside, it does appear a busted hold in OOTP is always given a BS

slugga27 · 04-05-2018, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heyctg

So i guess this doesn;t really belong in a bug category based on the feedback, but offical MLB rules on what is a save are:

For a save opportunity, a pitcher must be the final pitcher for his team (and not the winning pitcher) and do one of the following:

Enter the game with a lead of no more than three runs and pitch at least one inning.

Enter the game with the tying run in the on-deck circle -- or closer to scoring.

Pitch at least three innings.

which is how I always understood it, the key being final pitcher..So a reliever who comes in after a SP goes 4 innings and gives up the lead doesn't Blow a save unless he's the last pitcher. That's not what is occuring

So if I wasn't clear, I'm seeing multiple BS stats for one team in a game at times, The situation i mention and then a true blown save when the last picther fails a save oppurtunity as outlined above.

Key words: ONE of the following. Not all three.

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BoomerSoonerAMH · 04-05-2018, 08:40 PM

I’ve noticed this issue as well. The problem I have that I think the OP is getting at is with the following situation:

SP pitches 4 innings and leaves with a 8-5 lead. The SP is not eligible to be the winning pitcher because he didn’t complete 5 innings. Typically the first RP to follow the SP will be credited with the win as long as his team maintains the lead. In this case, such a RP can’t get a save because regardless of meeting the requirements of a save, no pitcher can be the winning pitcher and be credited with a save.

So the problem is that there is no possible way for a RP that comes in prior to the 6th inning to get a save. If the RP finishes the game without giving up the lead as required to earn a save, he would actually become the winning pitcher. Therefore it is impossible to consider such a situation a save situation. Per MLB’s website, “A blown save occurs when a relief pitcher enters a game in a save situation, but allows the tying run to score.” If we agree it isn’t possible for the situation I described to be a save situation, then by MLB’s definition, it can’t be a blown save.

heyctg · 04-05-2018, 08:58 PM

right, and to the prior comment about keyword being one of the 3 scenarios to be a save opporunity:
...yes it is ONE of the three but the other key is FINAL pitcher.

The example I posted is just what was just described, Newcomb left after 4 innings with teh lead, Cabera pitched one inning<the 5th> blew the lead and incoreectly gets a Blown Save

BoomerSoonerAMH · 04-05-2018, 09:42 PM

Actually in the scenario you showed, Newcomb pitched 5 innings and was thus eligible to be the winning pitcher. As such, Cabrera was properly given a BS as he was technically in a save situation. Had he completed the game without giving up the lead, he would have earned a save by way of having finished the game without giving up the lead and pitching at least 3 innings.

If Newcomb had pitched only 4 innings, Cabrera would not have been able to earn a save because he would have become the WP had he finished the game without giving up the lead.

heyctg · 04-05-2018, 10:20 PM

You are correct, sorry i posted a bad example with newcomb

My main point is I have witnessed Blown saves after the SP only goes 4 innings

slugga27 · 04-06-2018, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heyctg

You are correct, sorry i posted a bad example with newcomb

My main point is I have witnessed Blown saves after the SP only goes 4 innings

No offense, but your whole argument goes out the window because you haven’t posted an ACTUAL scenario to back it up. The ACTUAL scenario posted actually credited the BS correctly. There is no such thing as a blown hold. Give us proof. Your original post shows a scenario, but where’s THAT box score?

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heyctg · 04-06-2018, 08:46 PM

I am not trying to prove anything to anyone,certainly not trying to start a back and forth on this. I mentioned what I saw and stated my example was bad.So apologizes for any confusion there. Can we agree a Save opportunity for the reliever after the SP requires the starter to go 5 innings<to be win eligible> and if he does not complete 5 innings, the next pitcher if he loses the lead did not blow a save opportunity?

BALTIMORE PITCHING LINESCORE NEW YORK PITCHING LINESCORE
Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA
T. Scott 4.2 3 2 2 4 4 0 90 49 5.19
R. Bleier BS (1) 0.1 2 1 1 0 1 1 12 8 4.91
D. O'Day 0.1 0 0 0 0 1 0 5 5 0.00
D. Hart 0.2 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1.13
J. Gurka 0.1 0 0 0 0 1 0 8 5 9.53
M. Castro 0.1 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 14.09
M. Givens 0.1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 4.05
B. Brach L (1-1) 2.2 2 1 1 0 2 0 45 30 1.80
PITCHING
Game Score: T. Scott 50
Batters Faced: T. Scott 21, R. Bleier 3, D. O'Day 1, D. Hart 1, J. Gurka 1, M. Castro 1, M. Givens 1, B. Brach 10
Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Scott 4-5, R. Bleier 0-0, D. O'Day 0-0, D. Hart 0-1, J.

scott goes 4.2 innings, next pitcher gets 1 out, gives up the lead ...giving a BS.

another:

WASHINGTON PITCHING LINESCORE ATLANTA PITCHING LINESCORE
Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA
T. Roark 4.2 10 8 8 1 3 2 87 59 15.43
M. Grace L (0-1), BS (1) 0.1 4 4 4 0 0 1 16 9 9.82
E. Romero 1.1 1 1 0 1 0 0 20 13 0.00
B. Kintzler 0.0 1 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 0.00
T. Gott 0.0 0 0 0 1 0 0 5 1 9.00
R. Madson 1.2 3 3 2 0 1 0 38 20 5.40
PITCHING
Game Score: T. Roark 14
Batters Faced: T. Roark 25, M. Grace 5, E. Romero 6, B. Kintzler 1, T. Gott 1, R. Madson 9
Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Roark 5-6, M. Grace 0-1, E. Romero 2-1, B. Kintzler 0-0, T. Gott 0-0, R. Madson 1-2
Pitches - Strikes: T. Roark 87-59, M. Grace 16-9, E. Romero 20-13, B. Kintzler 2-1, T. Gott 5-1, R. Madson 38-20
Inherited Runners - Scored: B. Kintzler 1-1 , T. Gott 1-0 , R. Madson 2-0
WP: T. Roark , M. Grace
Hit Batsmen: R. Madson

goes 4.2 innings, next pitcher gets the loss and a BS

LOS ANGELES PITCHING LINESCORE HOUSTON PITCHING LINESCORE
Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA
T. Skaggs 4.0 8 6 2 1 1 2 78 46 5.86
L. Bard BS (2) 2.0 1 1 1 0 3 1 29 19 5.94
J. Alvarez 1.0 1 0 0 1 1 0 16 9 2.61
C. Bedrosian H (4) 1.0 2 0 0 0 2 0 19 13 0.00
B. Parker H (1) 0.1 0 1 1 1 1 0 11 4 1.59
B. Wood L (0-1), BS (1) 0.1 1 1 1 0 0 1 7 5 2.00
PITCHING
Game Score: T. Skaggs 30
Batters Faced: T. Skaggs 22, L. Bard 8, J. Alvarez 5, C. Bedrosian 5, B. Parker 2, B. Wood 2
Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Skaggs 6-5, L. Bard 2-1, J. Alvarez 0-2, C. Bedrosian 0-1, B. Parker 0-0, B. Wood 0-1
Pitches - Strikes: T. Skaggs 78-46, L. Bard 29-19, J. Alvarez 16-9, C. Bedrosian 19-13, B. Parker 11-4, B. Wood 7-5

SP goes 4 innings, reliver goes 2 gives up the lead when the SP was not eligible, gets a BS

I'm up to 4/27 on my league, these are examples i have seen.

slugga27 · 04-06-2018, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heyctg

I am not trying to prove anything to anyone,certainly not trying to start a back and forth on this. I mentioned what I saw and stated my example was bad.So apologizes for any confusion there. Can we agree a Save opportunity for the reliever after the SP requires the starter to go 5 innings<to be win eligible> and if he does not complete 5 innings, the next pitcher if he loses the lead did not blow a save opportunity?

BALTIMORE PITCHING LINESCORENEW YORK PITCHING LINESCORE

PlayerIPHRERBBKHRPIPSERA

T. Scott4.232244090495.19

R. Bleier BS (1)0.12110111284.91

D. O'Day0.1000010550.00

D. Hart0.2000000111.13

J. Gurka0.1000010859.53

M. Castro0.10000001114.09

M. Givens0.1000000214.05

B. Brach L (1-1)2.221102045301.80

PITCHING

Game Score: T. Scott 50

Batters Faced: T. Scott 21, R. Bleier 3, D. O'Day 1, D. Hart 1, J. Gurka 1, M. Castro 1, M. Givens 1, B. Brach 10

Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Scott 4-5, R. Bleier 0-0, D. O'Day 0-0, D. Hart 0-1, J.

scott goes 4.2 innings, next pitcher gets 1 out, gives up the lead ...giving a BS.

another:

WASHINGTON PITCHING LINESCOREATLANTA PITCHING LINESCORE

PlayerIPHRERBBKHRPIPSERA

T. Roark4.21088132875915.43

M. Grace L (0-1), BS (1)0.14440011699.82

E. Romero1.111010020130.00

B. Kintzler0.0100000210.00

T. Gott0.0000100519.00

R. Madson1.233201038205.40

PITCHING

Game Score: T. Roark 14

Batters Faced: T. Roark 25, M. Grace 5, E. Romero 6, B. Kintzler 1, T. Gott 1, R. Madson 9

Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Roark 5-6, M. Grace 0-1, E. Romero 2-1, B. Kintzler 0-0, T. Gott 0-0, R. Madson 1-2

Pitches - Strikes: T. Roark 87-59, M. Grace 16-9, E. Romero 20-13, B. Kintzler 2-1, T. Gott 5-1, R. Madson 38-20

Inherited Runners - Scored: B. Kintzler 1-1 , T. Gott 1-0 , R. Madson 2-0

WP: T. Roark , M. Grace

Hit Batsmen: R. Madson

goes 4.2 innings, next pitcher gets the loss and a BS

LOS ANGELES PITCHING LINESCOREHOUSTON PITCHING LINESCORE

PlayerIPHRERBBKHRPIPSERA

T. Skaggs4.086211278465.86

L. Bard BS (2)2.011103129195.94

J. Alvarez1.01001101692.61

C. Bedrosian H (4)1.020002019130.00

B. Parker H (1)0.10111101141.59

B. Wood L (0-1), BS (1)0.1111001752.00

PITCHING

Game Score: T. Skaggs 30

Batters Faced: T. Skaggs 22, L. Bard 8, J. Alvarez 5, C. Bedrosian 5, B. Parker 2, B. Wood 2

Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Skaggs 6-5, L. Bard 2-1, J. Alvarez 0-2, C. Bedrosian 0-1, B. Parker 0-0, B. Wood 0-1

Pitches - Strikes: T. Skaggs 78-46, L. Bard 29-19, J. Alvarez 16-9, C. Bedrosian 19-13, B. Parker 11-4, B. Wood 7-5

SP goes 4 innings, reliver goes 2 gives up the lead when the SP was not eligible, gets a BS

I'm up to 4/27 on my league, these are examples i have seen.

That’s more to your point, and it’s possible the game is considering 4.2 IP to be the same as 5 IP. I’ll have to test this, but that is a possibility.

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BoomerSoonerAMH · 04-07-2018, 05:19 AM

I've seen a BS given to the first RP out of the pen when he starter only goes 4.0 IP, so I unless it considers 4.0 IP the same as 5.0, I don't think so. At this point, the most relevant piece of research I can think to do is to find an MLB game where the SP went 4.0 IP and the next reliever gave up the lead. In such a case, we can see how it was scored in a real game. Following the logic I've given above, I don't think it should be a BS, but I'm not above acknowledging that I could be wrong.

drhay53 · 04-07-2018, 03:45 PM

If you didn't blow the save, you would have been the final pitcher. That's one piece of logic that's missing.

But I think the key thing here, is that if the starter is not eligible for a win because he didn't last long enough, then the pitcher who comes in would get a win if he went the rest of the way, not a save. So in some sense it is not a save opportunity, although, by the logic of the save rules, it seems to be.

I think you should find some box scores from real MLB and see how the official scorer does these types of things. It's not that important to me, so I don't feel like doing it, but there should be plenty of games out there where the starter goes less than 5 but has a lead, and the next guy in gives it up. My hunch is that is shouldn't be a blown save because the player is eligible for a win, which supersedes the save opportunity, but I'm curious to know how it's actually scored.

04-05-2018, 02:24 PM	#1
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	Blown save calculation Hi, been playing for years. I have noticed a lot of blown saves I think are incorrect, and often after 4 innings where it is not a save situation. SP goes 4, has the lead next pitcher gives up the lead and in the stat line it is BS. 4 innings for a SP isn't a W situation so I think the stat is wrong. Has this been documented?

04-05-2018, 03:02 PM	#2
Rain King Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 3,072 Infractions: 1/1 (1)	Blown Saves are given in essentially any situation where a pitcher would have earned either a Hold or a Save (so in simplest terms, if they enter a game with a 1-3 run lead and give the lead up). Do you have an example of one you do not believe should have been issued?

04-05-2018, 03:12 PM	#3
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	So it is intended a blown Hold, which is what I am seeing after 4 innings of a starter with the lead and then the reliever gives that lead up, is recorded as a blown save? Is that a game design decision? my understanding is blown save is specific to a save situation

04-05-2018, 05:55 PM	#5
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	So i guess this doesn;t really belong in a bug category based on the feedback, but offical MLB rules on what is a save are: For a save opportunity, a pitcher must be the final pitcher for his team (and not the winning pitcher) and do one of the following: Enter the game with a lead of no more than three runs and pitch at least one inning. Enter the game with the tying run in the on-deck circle -- or closer to scoring. Pitch at least three innings. which is how I always understood it, the key being final pitcher..So a reliever who comes in after a SP goes 4 innings and gives up the lead doesn't Blow a save unless he's the last pitcher. That's not what is occuring So if I wasn't clear, I'm seeing multiple BS stats for one team in a game at times, The situation i mention and then a true blown save when the last picther fails a save oppurtunity as outlined above.

04-05-2018, 06:56 PM	#6
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	ATLANTA PITCHING LINESCORE CINCINNATI PITCHING LINESCORE Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA S. Newcomb 5.0 5 5 5 2 5 2 87 54 9.90 M. Cabrera BS (2) 1.0 2 1 1 0 1 0 19 14 3.86 R. Brothers 1.0 0 0 0 0 1 0 15 10 0.60 A. Minter W (1-2) 1.0 0 0 0 2 2 0 23 11 5.11 A. Vizcaino SV (1) 1.0 0 0 0 1 2 0 26 14 2.84 This is an example from my season, Cabrera should not have a BS if he is not the final pitcher - he pitched the 5th inning and gave up the lead blowing a hold I see from an internet search there is debate on this issue outside of OOTP. So I'll subside, it does appear a busted hold in OOTP is always given a BS

04-05-2018, 08:40 PM	#8
BoomerSoonerAMH Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 111	I’ve noticed this issue as well. The problem I have that I think the OP is getting at is with the following situation: SP pitches 4 innings and leaves with a 8-5 lead. The SP is not eligible to be the winning pitcher because he didn’t complete 5 innings. Typically the first RP to follow the SP will be credited with the win as long as his team maintains the lead. In this case, such a RP can’t get a save because regardless of meeting the requirements of a save, no pitcher can be the winning pitcher and be credited with a save. So the problem is that there is no possible way for a RP that comes in prior to the 6th inning to get a save. If the RP finishes the game without giving up the lead as required to earn a save, he would actually become the winning pitcher. Therefore it is impossible to consider such a situation a save situation. Per MLB’s website, “A blown save occurs when a relief pitcher enters a game in a save situation, but allows the tying run to score.” If we agree it isn’t possible for the situation I described to be a save situation, then by MLB’s definition, it can’t be a blown save.

04-05-2018, 08:58 PM	#9
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	right, and to the prior comment about keyword being one of the 3 scenarios to be a save opporunity: ...yes it is ONE of the three but the other key is FINAL pitcher. The example I posted is just what was just described, Newcomb left after 4 innings with teh lead, Cabera pitched one inning<the 5th> blew the lead and incoreectly gets a Blown Save

04-05-2018, 09:42 PM	#10
BoomerSoonerAMH Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 111	Actually in the scenario you showed, Newcomb pitched 5 innings and was thus eligible to be the winning pitcher. As such, Cabrera was properly given a BS as he was technically in a save situation. Had he completed the game without giving up the lead, he would have earned a save by way of having finished the game without giving up the lead and pitching at least 3 innings. If Newcomb had pitched only 4 innings, Cabrera would not have been able to earn a save because he would have become the WP had he finished the game without giving up the lead.

04-05-2018, 10:20 PM	#11
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	You are correct, sorry i posted a bad example with newcomb My main point is I have witnessed Blown saves after the SP only goes 4 innings

04-06-2018, 08:46 PM	#13
heyctg Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 22	I am not trying to prove anything to anyone,certainly not trying to start a back and forth on this. I mentioned what I saw and stated my example was bad.So apologizes for any confusion there. Can we agree a Save opportunity for the reliever after the SP requires the starter to go 5 innings<to be win eligible> and if he does not complete 5 innings, the next pitcher if he loses the lead did not blow a save opportunity? BALTIMORE PITCHING LINESCORE NEW YORK PITCHING LINESCORE Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA T. Scott 4.2 3 2 2 4 4 0 90 49 5.19 R. Bleier BS (1) 0.1 2 1 1 0 1 1 12 8 4.91 D. O'Day 0.1 0 0 0 0 1 0 5 5 0.00 D. Hart 0.2 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1.13 J. Gurka 0.1 0 0 0 0 1 0 8 5 9.53 M. Castro 0.1 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 14.09 M. Givens 0.1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 4.05 B. Brach L (1-1) 2.2 2 1 1 0 2 0 45 30 1.80 PITCHING Game Score: T. Scott 50 Batters Faced: T. Scott 21, R. Bleier 3, D. O'Day 1, D. Hart 1, J. Gurka 1, M. Castro 1, M. Givens 1, B. Brach 10 Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Scott 4-5, R. Bleier 0-0, D. O'Day 0-0, D. Hart 0-1, J. scott goes 4.2 innings, next pitcher gets 1 out, gives up the lead ...giving a BS. another: WASHINGTON PITCHING LINESCORE ATLANTA PITCHING LINESCORE Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA T. Roark 4.2 10 8 8 1 3 2 87 59 15.43 M. Grace L (0-1), BS (1) 0.1 4 4 4 0 0 1 16 9 9.82 E. Romero 1.1 1 1 0 1 0 0 20 13 0.00 B. Kintzler 0.0 1 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 0.00 T. Gott 0.0 0 0 0 1 0 0 5 1 9.00 R. Madson 1.2 3 3 2 0 1 0 38 20 5.40 PITCHING Game Score: T. Roark 14 Batters Faced: T. Roark 25, M. Grace 5, E. Romero 6, B. Kintzler 1, T. Gott 1, R. Madson 9 Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Roark 5-6, M. Grace 0-1, E. Romero 2-1, B. Kintzler 0-0, T. Gott 0-0, R. Madson 1-2 Pitches - Strikes: T. Roark 87-59, M. Grace 16-9, E. Romero 20-13, B. Kintzler 2-1, T. Gott 5-1, R. Madson 38-20 Inherited Runners - Scored: B. Kintzler 1-1 , T. Gott 1-0 , R. Madson 2-0 WP: T. Roark , M. Grace Hit Batsmen: R. Madson goes 4.2 innings, next pitcher gets the loss and a BS LOS ANGELES PITCHING LINESCORE HOUSTON PITCHING LINESCORE Player IP H R ER BB K HR PI PS ERA T. Skaggs 4.0 8 6 2 1 1 2 78 46 5.86 L. Bard BS (2) 2.0 1 1 1 0 3 1 29 19 5.94 J. Alvarez 1.0 1 0 0 1 1 0 16 9 2.61 C. Bedrosian H (4) 1.0 2 0 0 0 2 0 19 13 0.00 B. Parker H (1) 0.1 0 1 1 1 1 0 11 4 1.59 B. Wood L (0-1), BS (1) 0.1 1 1 1 0 0 1 7 5 2.00 PITCHING Game Score: T. Skaggs 30 Batters Faced: T. Skaggs 22, L. Bard 8, J. Alvarez 5, C. Bedrosian 5, B. Parker 2, B. Wood 2 Ground Outs - Fly Outs: T. Skaggs 6-5, L. Bard 2-1, J. Alvarez 0-2, C. Bedrosian 0-1, B. Parker 0-0, B. Wood 0-1 Pitches - Strikes: T. Skaggs 78-46, L. Bard 29-19, J. Alvarez 16-9, C. Bedrosian 19-13, B. Parker 11-4, B. Wood 7-5 SP goes 4 innings, reliver goes 2 gives up the lead when the SP was not eligible, gets a BS I'm up to 4/27 on my league, these are examples i have seen.

04-07-2018, 05:19 AM	#15
BoomerSoonerAMH Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 111	I've seen a BS given to the first RP out of the pen when he starter only goes 4.0 IP, so I unless it considers 4.0 IP the same as 5.0, I don't think so. At this point, the most relevant piece of research I can think to do is to find an MLB game where the SP went 4.0 IP and the next reliever gave up the lead. In such a case, we can see how it was scored in a real game. Following the logic I've given above, I don't think it should be a BS, but I'm not above acknowledging that I could be wrong.

04-07-2018, 03:45 PM	#16
drhay53 Major Leagues Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 355	If you didn't blow the save, you would have been the final pitcher. That's one piece of logic that's missing. But I think the key thing here, is that if the starter is not eligible for a win because he didn't last long enough, then the pitcher who comes in would get a win if he went the rest of the way, not a save. So in some sense it is not a save opportunity, although, by the logic of the save rules, it seems to be. I think you should find some box scores from real MLB and see how the official scorer does these types of things. It's not that important to me, so I don't feel like doing it, but there should be plenty of games out there where the starter goes less than 5 but has a lead, and the next guy in gives it up. My hunch is that is shouldn't be a blown save because the player is eligible for a win, which supersedes the save opportunity, but I'm curious to know how it's actually scored.