Kbo식 연봉 조정에 관한 아이디어 건의.

[XinKer Kim]

reserve clause rule의 로직을 활용한다면, 조정위원회 방식의 문제를 해결할 수 있을 것 같습니다.

조정위원회 방식에서는 80%이하로의 삭감이 불가능하고, 위원회에서의 결정은 (거의 대부분) 상승방향으로만 작용합니다.

reserve-clause룰에서는 조정위원회를 가지 않고 AI가 직접 연봉을 책정해주는 것으로 알고있습니다. 이 방식의 로직을 자세히 알지는 못하지만, 이 방향이 조정위원회 방식보다 KBO의 (서비스타임 내) 연봉 지급과 유사합니다.

이러한 연봉 결정 방식, FA와 높은 연봉 기준선이 복합적으로 작용할 수 있다면, 구현도를 끌어올릴 수 있다고 생각됩니다.

활용의 여지가 있을까요?

+ 비확대 중재 방식은 ***에는 있으나, KBO에는 그런 방식이 있다는 사실을 본 적이 없습니다. ***/KBO 스타일이라는 표기는 잘못된 정보라고 판단됩니다. (*** Style ONLY.)

[spike333]

1. In the financial setting, the reserve clause option has a logic similar to that of kbo's salary adjustment.
What do you think about introducing this? At least it looks better than the current Non-escalating Arbitration.
Currently, in non-escalating arbitration, salary cuts and increases do not match the reality of kbo.

2. And there is the problem of foreign players' major league service time.
At the end of the contract period, if the player's service time is less than 8 years, they will not be released as FA.
And in reality, foreign players who advance to the kbo league cannot get the title of Rookie of the Year.

3. And from 2023, kbo will be able to have one foreign player in the minor league, one for each pitcher and one for batter.
You need other options than the option of allowing all foreign players in the minor leagues like *** or Taiwan league.

4. And there's the problem with free agents. kbo does not match A/B type, CBA type, and cash compensation type supported by ootp.
It is not kbo's fa compensation, but it seems to be a better option if you mix A/B type and cash compensation type.

Sorry for my poor English.

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by spike333

1. In the financial setting, the reserve clause option has a logic similar to that of kbo's salary adjustment.
What do you think about introducing this? At least it looks better than the current Non-escalating Arbitration.
Currently, in non-escalating arbitration, salary cuts and increases do not match the reality of kbo.

2. And there is the problem of foreign players' major league service time.
At the end of the contract period, if the player's service time is less than 8 years, they will not be released as FA.
And in reality, foreign players who advance to the kbo league cannot get the title of Rookie of the Year.

3. And from 2023, kbo will be able to have one foreign player in the minor league, one for each pitcher and one for batter.
You need other options than the option of allowing all foreign players in the minor leagues like *** or Taiwan league.

4. And there's the problem with free agents. kbo does not match A/B type, CBA type, and cash compensation type supported by ootp.
It is not kbo's fa compensation, but it seems to be a better option if you mix A/B type and cash compensation type.

Sorry for my poor English.

Some interesting points here!

For 1, it's possible that the reserve clause settings would indeed work better to reflect the reality of the KBO salary structure. There's certainly no reason we couldn't set the KBO to use this in-game if it's felt that this better reflects the KBO process but we'd be interested in hearing options on that from people who have tried both methods.

2. This is a known problem with the current OOTP service time system, not with the KBO only but with other international leagues as well. It's something we're aware of and is on our list of potential fixes/improvements to include in a future version of the game.

3. Yes, it completely makes sense to implement a feature like this for the minor leagues and it's also on our list of potential fixes/improvements to include in a future version of the game.

4. This is also something we'll look to improve sometime in the future.

[XinKer Kim]

Originally Posted by spike333

3. And from 2023, kbo will be able to have one foreign player in the minor league, one for each pitcher and one for batter.
You need other options than the option of allowing all foreign players in the minor leagues like *** or taiwan league.

예전엔 마이너리그에 외인옵션이 다르긴 했었어요.
구작에는 마이너리그에도 외인한도를 메이저리그와 같은 식으로 설정할 수 있었습니다. 그게 기능하지 못했을 뿐...
그 시절엔 무한영입 방출버그 등의 문제가 있었습니다.. 미봉책으로 틀어막은 것 같아요.

[spike333]

In kbo, there were -90% and 400% salary arbitration
A 300-400% increase rate is one of the few rare cases like monster players (ex. Hanwha 2nd year Ryu Hyun-jin 8.23war).

I will attach photos of salary arbitration results for 2020 and 2021.

There were only two cases where a player won the salary arbitration.
However, I am not sure if the salary should be set as a unilateral decision by the club like the reserve clause option.




I'm sorry. The link is not working due to an error in one of the photos.

[Matt Arnold]

For the salary arbitration issue, we can certainly adjust things if the current values are not realistic. Is it mostly that the range of salaries that we can adjust to is not wide enough?

I'm definitely happy to learn more about the system, if there are further things we can do to better reflect the reality. We may not really be able to reflect the largest outliers (-90% or +450%), just because if we had the system allow that it will often cause all the other values to be too much. But the more information people can share about some general cases, if the contracts that we get "wrong" currently are more players who had great years or terrible years, or players who have been on a team a long time or a short time, etc... the better we can make the system.

[XinKer Kim]

Arbitration logic을 수정할 수 있다면, 그것이 최선일것입니다.
-90%와 +450%의 변화는 그들의 연봉이 27mil 원(최저 수준)과 500mil 원(maybe Star Player base line)이라는 기초값에 상당부분 기인할 것입니다.

그러나, -50% 정도의 변화는 충분히 일어나는 수준입니다. 현재의 Arbitration System에서는 -20% 밑으로 가는 것은 불가능합니다. Arbitration 이전에 계약 연장을 할 수는 있지만, 역시나 연봉 삭감은 (굉장히) 제한적입니다.
한편, 대부분의 KBO 선수들은 연봉조정 단계 이전에 구단과 연봉 협상을 통해 계약을 갱신합니다. 조정신청을 하는 경우도 드물고, 조정위원회에 가는 케이스는 극히 드뭅니다. Since 1983, only 21 out of 98 cases have applied for Arbitration until the end without cancellation. 약 40년 간 100건 미만의 조정신청, 20회 남짓의 위원회 판결 (그리고 고작 2차례의 선수 승리)이 KBO 연봉 조정의 현황입니다. 물론 2020년대에 들어, MLB를 닮아가고 있기는 합니다. The 2nd player's win occurred in 2021. 이것은 9년만의 조정 신청이며, 19년만의 승리입니다.
However, it is becoming similar to MLB : still No QO, 4 years needed for FA Requalification, 9-year for FA(8 years for 4-year graduates, compensation for service time based on national team performance), but FA Rating system, Foreigner Limit Increase, and so on...

하한선을 -20%에서 -50%정도로 늘리는 것이 logic에 직접적인 변화를 낳을 수 있을지는 모르지만, 하한선을 확장하는 것은 확실하게 필요합니다.

* If there is anything that reads unnatural, please mention/quote it. I will rewrite that part in English.