Home | Webstore
Latest News: OOTP 26 Available - FHM 11 Available - OOTP Go! Available

Out of the Park Baseball 26 Buy Now!

  

Go Back   OOTP Developments Forums > Out of the Park Developments > Talk Sports

Talk Sports Discuss everything that is sports-related, like MLB, NFL, NHL, NBA, MLS, NASCAR, NCAA sports and teams, trades, coaches, bad calls etc.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-19-2022, 06:19 AM   #121
Westheim
Hall Of Famer
 
Westheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Germany
Posts: 13,621
Hey, hey, Tigers scored 14 runs in one game?

A.k.a. a week's worth.
__________________
Portland Raccoons, 92 years of excell-.... of baseball: Furballs here!
1983 * 1989 * 1991 * 1992 * 1993 * 1995 * 1996 * 2010 * 2017 * 2018 * 2019 * 2026 * 2028 * 2035 * 2037 * 2044 * 2045 * 2046 * 2047 * 2048 * 2051 * 2054 * 2055 * 2061
1 OSANAI : 2 POWELL : 7 NOMURA | RAMOS : 8 REECE : 10 BROWN : 15 HALL : 27 FERNANDEZ : 28 CASAS : 31 CARMONA : 32 WEST : 39 TONER : 46 SAITO

Resident Mets Cynic - The Mets from 1962 onwards, here.
Westheim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2022, 08:47 AM   #122
cephasjames
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,736
Hopefully they didn't use up all their runs for the week.
__________________
5000+ Generic Logos Free for the Taking
FREE: Uniforms and logos for 500+ teams spanning 1871-present
Great Lakes League: 10 Conferences, 100 Teams
Pre-OOTP 23 Custom Cap & Jersey Template v3.0 by Deft and NoPepper (with layers from other various artists) that I use: Caps, Jerseys
cephasjames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2022, 12:41 PM   #123
Leo_The_Lip
All Star Starter
 
Leo_The_Lip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,796
Quote:
Originally Posted by Westheim View Post
Hey, hey, Tigers scored 14 runs in one game?

A.k.a. a week's worth.
This reminds me of the story from the early Mets days. You could call up a number at the phone company and ask for the scores. A lot of guys played 13-run pools back then (me included) and one caller asked "How many runs did the Mets score today?"

"19"

A pause. "Did they win?"
__________________
"My name will live forever" - Anonymous
Leo_The_Lip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2022, 07:40 AM   #124
cephasjames
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,736
CBS Sports article about the Tigers' woes: Tigers' path back undone by injuries, poor play

Quote:
This was supposed to be the year the Detroit Tigers were going to transition from rebuilding and to contending... Rather than serve as a springboard toward contention -- and possibly even to an expanded postseason spot -- that 68-61 finish to 2021 is starting to look like the aberration... What's gone wrong in Detroit? Well, a lot.
__________________
5000+ Generic Logos Free for the Taking
FREE: Uniforms and logos for 500+ teams spanning 1871-present
Great Lakes League: 10 Conferences, 100 Teams
Pre-OOTP 23 Custom Cap & Jersey Template v3.0 by Deft and NoPepper (with layers from other various artists) that I use: Caps, Jerseys
cephasjames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2022, 01:09 PM   #125
Westheim
Hall Of Famer
 
Westheim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Germany
Posts: 13,621
Quote:
Originally Posted by cephasjames View Post
CBS Sports article about the Tigers' woes: Tigers' path back undone by injuries, poor play
That is a great little article.

But don't read it to your kids before bed; they will never stop having nightmares.
__________________
Portland Raccoons, 92 years of excell-.... of baseball: Furballs here!
1983 * 1989 * 1991 * 1992 * 1993 * 1995 * 1996 * 2010 * 2017 * 2018 * 2019 * 2026 * 2028 * 2035 * 2037 * 2044 * 2045 * 2046 * 2047 * 2048 * 2051 * 2054 * 2055 * 2061
1 OSANAI : 2 POWELL : 7 NOMURA | RAMOS : 8 REECE : 10 BROWN : 15 HALL : 27 FERNANDEZ : 28 CASAS : 31 CARMONA : 32 WEST : 39 TONER : 46 SAITO

Resident Mets Cynic - The Mets from 1962 onwards, here.
Westheim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2022, 06:51 PM   #126
Cap
Hall Of Famer
 
Cap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Large Province in God's Country
Posts: 7,947
Quote:
Originally Posted by CONN CHRIS View Post
Riley Greene is back at last. Hoping for a spark!
Hey, Chris. How you been? Check your PMs lately?

Cap
__________________
"...There were Giants in Those Days.."
Cap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2022, 09:09 AM   #127
cephasjames
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,736
Who gets traded?

With this season a bust and the trade deadline just a little over a month away, who do you think the Tigers (try to or are willing to) unload? I do think the Tigers are done rebuilding and are now on the build side of things, but this is a lost year so trading any player is really just to see what can be gotten for them.

I think the Tigers who make that list are:
Candelario*
Schoop*
Grossman**
Barnhart***

*because they have Kody Clemens and the Castros to fill in whatever gaps are created. Also Grossman
** because the organization has a lot of outfielders
***because he's a valuable catcher who'll be a free agent at the end of the year

Having said this, I'm not sure if any of these guys will draw any interest. Maybe Barnhart for his defense but that's about it.

Thoughts?
__________________
5000+ Generic Logos Free for the Taking
FREE: Uniforms and logos for 500+ teams spanning 1871-present
Great Lakes League: 10 Conferences, 100 Teams
Pre-OOTP 23 Custom Cap & Jersey Template v3.0 by Deft and NoPepper (with layers from other various artists) that I use: Caps, Jerseys
cephasjames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 08:20 AM   #128
cephasjames
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,736
I guess I forgot about pitchers. Fulmer and Soto might be on the list too. Though I think it would behoove the Tigers to hold onto Fulmer.
__________________
5000+ Generic Logos Free for the Taking
FREE: Uniforms and logos for 500+ teams spanning 1871-present
Great Lakes League: 10 Conferences, 100 Teams
Pre-OOTP 23 Custom Cap & Jersey Template v3.0 by Deft and NoPepper (with layers from other various artists) that I use: Caps, Jerseys
cephasjames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 08:26 AM   #129
CONN CHRIS
Global Moderator
 
CONN CHRIS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 29,001
I hope they don't go into sell mode. Stick with the plan. This is a good group suffering catastrophic levels of injury. In addition to the players stacked up like cordwood on the IL, they have Spencer Turnbull and Jake Rodgers coming back late this year.

Don't give up so easily!
__________________
CONN CHRIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 02:18 PM   #130
Cod
All Star Starter
 
Cod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 1,104
Did the Tigers rework their scouting and player development personnel around 2017/2018? Since 2018, they have done a much better job in the draft (some of this may be due to the talent pools being better with high picks) while also developing said players on a decent trajectory. Their first round picks have been great, but they've done a much better job beyond the first round as well with picks like Dillion Dingler, Ty Madden, and Izaac Pacheco. They've found some international prospects early as well, like Roberto Campos and Cristian Santana.

If they can keep AJ Hinch in charge with Chris Fetter as the pitching coach, I think Detroit will be a very good team in the next year or two.
Cod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 05:09 PM   #131
Hrycaj
All Star Starter
 
Hrycaj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,669
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cod View Post
Did the Tigers rework their scouting and player development personnel around 2017/2018? Since 2018, they have done a much better job in the draft (some of this may be due to the talent pools being better with high picks) while also developing said players on a decent trajectory. Their first round picks have been great, but they've done a much better job beyond the first round as well with picks like Dillion Dingler, Ty Madden, and Izaac Pacheco. They've found some international prospects early as well, like Roberto Campos and Cristian Santana.

If they can keep AJ Hinch in charge with Chris Fetter as the pitching coach, I think Detroit will be a very good team in the next year or two.
I feel like their development of players is what has been holding this organization back. It is the reason I feel like Avila needs to go. I have no criticism toward the drafts but they have been mostly no-brainer picks. Trying to be patient but this year was a clear setback.
__________________
Click on my signature to read about the great game of baseball in Normington.

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/showthread.php?t=326812
Hrycaj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 05:10 PM   #132
Hrycaj
All Star Starter
 
Hrycaj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,669
For some reason this "Athletic" article is not blocked by the pay wall. Gives some nice insight as to why it took so long to diagnose Casey Mize's injury. Thought fellow Tigers fans would enjoy it.


https://theathletic.com/3359838/2022...ze-tommy-john/
__________________
Click on my signature to read about the great game of baseball in Normington.

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/showthread.php?t=326812
Hrycaj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 06:24 PM   #133
Cod
All Star Starter
 
Cod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 1,104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrycaj View Post
I feel like their development of players is what has been holding this organization back. It is the reason I feel like Avila needs to go. I have no criticism toward the drafts but they have been mostly no-brainer picks. Trying to be patient but this year was a clear setback.
Not sure I'd blame Avila since (I believe) he fired the previous player development director last season and gave the full-time job this year to Kenny Graham. Graham was the interim director last season. From what I've read, Graham is a good mix of new and old school...especially from a hitting philosophy standpoint.

Also, another reason I don't blame Avila yet is because he did revamp the entire player development pipeline and staff during the previous off-season.

https://www.blessyouboys.com/2021/9/...elopment-staff
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/sp...22/9121533002/

Last edited by Cod; 06-26-2022 at 06:37 PM.
Cod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 08:17 PM   #134
Hrycaj
All Star Starter
 
Hrycaj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,669
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cod View Post
Not sure I'd blame Avila since (I believe) he fired the previous player development director last season and gave the full-time job this year to Kenny Graham. Graham was the interim director last season. From what I've read, Graham is a good mix of new and old school...especially from a hitting philosophy standpoint.

Also, another reason I don't blame Avila yet is because he did revamp the entire player development pipeline and staff during the previous off-season.

https://www.blessyouboys.com/2021/9/...elopment-staff
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/sp...22/9121533002/
Graham was an interim hire but has been in the role from about 2019. He does categorize himself as a blend of new school and old school but do you think you have seen it? I'm not an againster. I love having good baseball conversations and you clearly know a bit more than the average guy. Where have we seen his philosophy (working with a players skill set to maximize performance) of playing out with any of our young guys? There isn't a prospect in the system that isn't striking out at a least a 2 to 3 to one ratio compared to their walks. Seriously, Carlos Mendoza is the only guy and he is not considered a high end prospect. I guess I'm just really frustrated at the fact that Minnesota and Cleveland routinely develop guys you have never heard of and the Tigers never seem to be able to match that.
__________________
Click on my signature to read about the great game of baseball in Normington.

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/showthread.php?t=326812
Hrycaj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 09:23 PM   #135
Cod
All Star Starter
 
Cod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 1,104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrycaj View Post
I love having good baseball conversations and you clearly know a bit more than the average guy.
Thanks for the compliment. Admittedly, I'm not a Detroit fan (or follower), just intrigued by their system as a whole as I try to branch out to teams I don't know much about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrycaj View Post
Where have we seen his philosophy (working with a players skill set to maximize performance) of playing out with any of our young guys? There isn't a prospect in the system that isn't striking out at a least a 2 to 3 to one ratio compared to their walks.
I'll have to do some historical research to better understand. I do think it would be fair to wait a couple of seasons to see how Graham truly plays out because he recently hired all new hitting and pitching coordinators. One of the new pitching coordinators was Casey Mize's coaches from Auburn. Then again, I could be completely off base after doing some research into the past decade of Detroit player development. Also, the scouts should be held accountable as well because let's be honest, some guys just aren't coach-able and have no work ethic (aka Elijah Dukes).
Cod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2022, 10:16 PM   #136
Cod
All Star Starter
 
Cod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 1,104
Doing some research on BR, I found the Tigers are averaging ~2.80 runs per game as of mid-June. Through the same amount of games, this is the lowest of any team since World War II. Even worse, after 59 games, the TIgers posted a team line of .218/.276/.317. That is absolutely terrible...no ifs, ands, or buts.

After, I took a look at the Detroit hitting coach, Scott Coolbaugh. Before Detroit, he was the hitting coach for the Orioles (2015-18), a White Sox assistant (2020), and random minor league organizations. Look at these numbers during his time with the Orioles:
2018 .239 .298 .391 .689
2017 .260 .312 .435 .747
2016 .256 .317 .443 .760
2015 .250 .307 .421 .728
Other than 2018, his teams were hitting in line with the MLB averages (+/- a few percentage points). Coolbaugh's performance with CWS in 2020 was above the MLB average.

I read that AJ Hinch doesn't allow Coolbaugh to talk to the media, so nobody knows what Coolbaugh's philosophy is, etc.. Did AJ Hinch have this mentality in Houston? Or is it something specific to Coolbaugh?

Ken Rosenthal wrote a lengthy article about Detroit's offensive problems last week, but I haven't had a chance to read it yet. You can find the article here: https://theathletic.com/3377830/2022...ailing-season/
Cod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2022, 07:52 AM   #137
Hrycaj
All Star Starter
 
Hrycaj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,669
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cod View Post
Doing some research on BR, I found the Tigers are averaging ~2.80 runs per game as of mid-June. Through the same amount of games, this is the lowest of any team since World War II. Even worse, after 59 games, the TIgers posted a team line of .218/.276/.317. That is absolutely terrible...no ifs, ands, or buts.

After, I took a look at the Detroit hitting coach, Scott Coolbaugh. Before Detroit, he was the hitting coach for the Orioles (2015-18), a White Sox assistant (2020), and random minor league organizations. Look at these numbers during his time with the Orioles:
2018 .239 .298 .391 .689
2017 .260 .312 .435 .747
2016 .256 .317 .443 .760
2015 .250 .307 .421 .728
Other than 2018, his teams were hitting in line with the MLB averages (+/- a few percentage points). Coolbaugh's performance with CWS in 2020 was above the MLB average.

I read that AJ Hinch doesn't allow Coolbaugh to talk to the media, so nobody knows what Coolbaugh's philosophy is, etc.. Did AJ Hinch have this mentality in Houston? Or is it something specific to Coolbaugh?

Ken Rosenthal wrote a lengthy article about Detroit's offensive problems last week, but I haven't had a chance to read it yet. You can find the article here: https://theathletic.com/3377830/2022...ailing-season/
I don't know about Houston but in Detroit Hinch has been very protective of his coaches. A.J. does a weekly piece with the local radio station and he always defends Scott and takes the arrows for him. I'm actually impressed with how he negotiates those weekly interviews. He doesn't shy away from the teams struggles but will not throw anyone under the bus. In this respect he has shown really nice leadership skills. Since we can't hear from Coolbaugh himself we only have what A.J. will share and he insists it is not a philosophical issue. Yet, time and again the Tigers have serious issues with their approach at the plate. Looking at Baseball Savant you can see they lead the league in chase rate and are at the bottom 3% in a number of offensive categories. (WOBA, Barrel %, exit velocity)https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/league
So if it is not philosophy then is it what you were alluding to earlier about coaching head strong players? My worry with the whole Javy Baez deal was you were adding a guy who has one of the worst profiles into a lineup that already had way too much swing and miss. The few hot, streaky weeks he will give you will not make it worth the investment. At this point in his career I don't think a hitting coach has any chance of reaching him. His game is obvious and established and the Tigers signed him anyway. I also don't think it helped that certain players out preformed their career numbers last year. When they regressed to their historical performances in a year where hitting is down across the league we have serious issues.
I have also yet to hear (maybe its out there and I haven't found it) any of the players giving any credit to Scott working with them. I routinely hear it with the pitchers and Chris Fetter. (Although admittedly, the Tigers rank near the bottom in first pitch strike percentage as well) Still, players are giving Chris credit for helping them with their development where you just aren't hearing it with Scott.
__________________
Click on my signature to read about the great game of baseball in Normington.

https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/showthread.php?t=326812

Last edited by Hrycaj; 06-27-2022 at 07:53 AM.
Hrycaj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2022, 06:26 PM   #138
Cod
All Star Starter
 
Cod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 1,104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrycaj View Post
I don't know about Houston but in Detroit Hinch has been very protective of his coaches. A.J. does a weekly piece with the local radio station and he always defends Scott and takes the arrows for him. I'm actually impressed with how he negotiates those weekly interviews. He doesn't shy away from the teams struggles but will not throw anyone under the bus. In this respect he has shown really nice leadership skills.
I agree that the leadership shown by Hinch is impressive, which is probably why he should stay in charge. At some point though, you cannot die on the sword continuing to defend / protect your hitting coaches, coordinators, etc. when the numbers being produced are abysmal.


Quote:
My worry with the whole Javy Baez deal was you were adding a guy who has one of the worst profiles into a lineup that already had way too much swing and miss. The few hot, streaky weeks he will give you will not make it worth the investment. At this point in his career I don't think a hitting coach has any chance of reaching him. His game is obvious and established and the Tigers signed him anyway.
Baez is a tough nut to crack. He is high energy, above average defensively, and can mash when he makes contact. He's tied for the AL lead with least errors at 10, and of note, he's only 1 of 2 shortstops on the list. Also, and I had to look this up twice to make sure I wasn't crazy, but Baez's strikeout rate is at a career low (by more than a few percentage points). The problem is, the average is way down. On the plus side, his XBH and HR numbers are in-line or better than previous seasons at the same number of games. With all that said, I still don't think he's worth near the $20M+ they're paying him for the next six seasons. Granted, there is an opt-out clause after 2024. Regardless, a guy like Baez shouldn't be taking up 15% of your 2022 payroll.


Quote:
I have also yet to hear (maybe its out there and I haven't found it) any of the players giving any credit to Scott working with them. I routinely hear it with the pitchers and Chris Fetter. (Although admittedly, the Tigers rank near the bottom in first pitch strike percentage as well) Still, players are giving Chris credit for helping them with their development where you just aren't hearing it with Scott.
I found this very interesting and the cynic in me thinks the team is covering for Coolbaugh for some reason. At some point, Avila has to force Hinch's hand or the owners will for Avila's.

Last edited by Cod; 06-27-2022 at 06:27 PM.
Cod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2022, 12:04 PM   #139
cephasjames
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,736
Quote:
Originally Posted by cephasjames View Post
With this season a bust and the trade deadline just a little over a month away, who do you think the Tigers (try to or are willing to) unload? I do think the Tigers are done rebuilding and are now on the build side of things, but this is a lost year so trading any player is really just to see what can be gotten for them.

I think the Tigers who make that list are:
Candelario*
Schoop*
Grossman**
Barnhart***

*because they have Kody Clemens and the Castros to fill in whatever gaps are created. Also Grossman
** because the organization has a lot of outfielders
***because he's a valuable catcher who'll be a free agent at the end of the year

Having said this, I'm not sure if any of these guys will draw any interest. Maybe Barnhart for his defense but that's about it.

Thoughts?
MLB trade deadline: Which Tigers could be targets?

Quote:
The obvious ones: Players on expiring contracts

Five players will be free agents after the season: Catcher Tucker Barnhart; outfielder Robbie Grossman; and right-handed pitchers Michael Fulmer, Michael Pineda and Wily Peralta.
Quote:
They’re not going anywhere: Players on underwater contracts

The players who fall into that category are: second baseman Jonathan Schoop (1 year, $7.5 million remaining after this year); shortstop Javier Baez (five years, $120 million); left-handed starter Eduardo Rodriguez (four years, $63 million); and designated hitter Miguel Cabrera (1 year, $40 million).
Quote:
Bullpen help

The Tigers have a surplus of arms in the pen and several are likely to attract legitimate interest from other clubs.

Avila will likely field calls about two lefties with different profiles: Ground-ball artist Andrew Chafin and flame-thrower Gregory Soto.

Alex Lange and Will Vest could be intriguing to teams as young arms who offer several years of team control.

It’s not clear that veteran Jose Cisnero will be healthy in time, but if he is, he’d certainly be on this list, too.

But there’s one other player who is quietly having a phenomenal year and is putting up better peripheral numbers than anyone else in the pen. That would be Joe Jimenez.
__________________
5000+ Generic Logos Free for the Taking
FREE: Uniforms and logos for 500+ teams spanning 1871-present
Great Lakes League: 10 Conferences, 100 Teams
Pre-OOTP 23 Custom Cap & Jersey Template v3.0 by Deft and NoPepper (with layers from other various artists) that I use: Caps, Jerseys
cephasjames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2022, 12:16 PM   #140
CONN CHRIS
Global Moderator
 
CONN CHRIS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 29,001
If they decide to re-start the re-build, I may have to just stop caring for a period of years for the first time in my 50 or so years of fandom.
__________________
CONN CHRIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:14 PM.

 

Major League and Minor League Baseball trademarks and copyrights are used with permission of Major League Baseball. Visit MLB.com and MiLB.com.

Officially Licensed Product – MLB Players, Inc.

Out of the Park Baseball is a registered trademark of Out of the Park Developments GmbH & Co. KG

Google Play is a trademark of Google Inc.

Apple, iPhone, iPod touch and iPad are trademarks of Apple Inc., registered in the U.S. and other countries.

COPYRIGHT © 2023 OUT OF THE PARK DEVELOPMENTS. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.

 

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright © 2024 Out of the Park Developments