Not Sure What To Call This Thread

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Sal Canata - WW 1933-45

Career Record: W38(KO 12) / L18(KO 8) / D7

Unknown information has been left blank.
BoxRec lists Sal's full name as Salvatore Canata

DOB and DOD from Find a Grave website for Salvatore Canata, 13 Oct 1913 to 26 Nov 1991. Buried Saint Jerome Cemetery, Holyoke, Hampden County, Massachusetts.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

So was looking at one, Mike O'Dowd who is listed in BoxRec as a middleweight with one fight in 1939 and being from Fitchburg, Mass. He was one of Hub Parker's opponents I found a fight record for that is not listed by Boxrec for Parker.

Stream lining these posts removing all the bio info I end up putting in the fighters file. shorten the length of his thread that I felt was getting TO LONG for anyone to delve through!

Have done some work on O'Dowd as he was called then. Will be getting back to him.

[Waltercito]

Those oldtimers changed their names more often than their underwear, it seems. This makes it really frustrating sometimes.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Originally Posted by Waltercito

Those oldtimers changed their names more often than their underwear, it seems. This makes it really frustrating sometimes.

It sure does, but I've actually found it to be an interesting challenge looking at some of these guys. I'm looking back through at this Walter Wazal / Wazel / Wasel or however it is actually spelled and found his name spelled these three different names and put on top of that he's apparently our Mike O'Dowd who fought Hub Parker. So many ways you have to try and search a name in the papers to find articles about them and/or their fights.

Rocco

[pilight]

A lot of times the venues, newspapers, and even promoters didn't ask the fighter how to spell their name, they just went with what they heard when the fighter said it. That led to considerable variation.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Originally Posted by pilight

A lot of times the venues, newspapers, and even promoters didn't ask the fighter how to spell their name, they just went with what they heard when the fighter said it. That led to considerable variation.

Interesting....can understand that some of the variations!

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Been spending the last couple days digging through articles for info on Walter Wazal as listed by BoxRec. Have pulled quite a bit of info but want to do more digging to accumulate info for all the info to find on the four different names I've been finding for what does appear to be the same fighter. What I found tonight is this.....

Thu, Dec 15, 1938, Kennebec Journal, Augusta, Maine - An article discussion about Vince Troiano of Portland, Maine, mentionse that Walter Wazal is one amongst 7 middleweights mentioned in the article that Troiano has fought and beaten. Found Vincenzo Troiano, BoxRec ID# 048421 and listed in his fights is a 6 round decision win against Walter Watzel (note the spelling!) on Jan 28, 1937. This Walter Watzel, ID# 152852 in BoxRec has 6 fights listed, one of course against Troiano, but more important is the BoxRec notes the Watzel as a southpaw, from Fitchburg, Mass and has an alias. Yes the "smoking gun" confirming I would say Wazal / Wazel / Watzel / Mike O'Dowd are all the same fighters.

I then go to look up that Jan 28, 1937 fight between Troiano and Watzel and the various newspaper pre-fight and fight summary articles all spelled Walter's name as Wazal or Wazel!!???!!! No T in it. So how BoxRec got the Watzel spelling I'd love find out.

Rocco

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Originally Posted by Rocco Del Sesto

Been spending the last couple days digging through articles for info on Walter Wazal as listed by BoxRec. Have pulled quite a bit of info but want to do more digging to accumulate info for all the info to find on the four different names I've been finding for what does appear to be the same fighter. What I found tonight is this.....

Thu, Dec 15, 1938, Kennebec Journal, Augusta, Maine - An article discussion about Vince Troiano of Portland, Maine, mentionse that Walter Wazal is one amongst 7 middleweights mentioned in the article that Troiano has fought and beaten. Found Vincenzo Troiano, BoxRec ID# 048421 and listed in his fights is a 6 round decision win against Walter Watzel (note the spelling!) on Jan 28, 1937. This Walter Watzel, ID# 152852 in BoxRec has 6 fights listed, one of course against Troiano, but more important is the BoxRec notes the Watzel as a southpaw, from Fitchburg, Mass and has an alias. Yes the "smoking gun" confirming I would say Wazal / Wazel / Watzel / Mike O'Dowd are all the same fighters.

I then go to look up that Jan 28, 1937 fight between Troiano and Watzel and the various newspaper pre-fight and fight summary articles all spelled Walter's name as Wazal or Wazel!!???!!! No T in it. So how BoxRec got the Watzel spelling I'd love find out.

Rocco

BTW.....The Vicenzo Troiano record shows a 10 round Draw with our buddy Hub Parker in Sept 1939. So another piece to look at for him.
Hope I'm not boring yas all with this stuff, but I've found looking through these New England paper records and the fight history in these Mid-Late 1930's kind of interesting. Make me think maybe concentrate for a bit on some of these guys from this time in these New England boxing shows.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

I'll add at this point I've not really found yet a link with the Mike O'Dowd in BoxEec with fights listed 1940-48, only the one I believe that shows one fight in 1939 think it was

[Waltercito]

Originally Posted by Rocco Del Sesto

BTW.....The Vicenzo Troiano record shows a 10 round Draw with our buddy Hub Parker in Sept 1939. So another piece to look at for him.
Hope I'm not boring yas all with this stuff, .

Absolutly not, I love it.


You know, I'm also a horse racing enthusiast, and while in most "serious" countries a racehorse can have only one single name, which on top of that has to follow certain rules, this is not so in Paraguay, where I originally come from. In my spare time, I do research for the paraguayan Stud Book, and because in past times, many horses entered Paraguay illegally from Argentina or Brasil, their new paraguayan owners obviously changed their names for a fake one...and oh boy, I spent days searching in newspapers, writing e-mails to farms and foreign stud books, even comparing old pictures or videos to identify certain horses...you have to really love this stuff to do it.


So keep going, these oldtimers need their records completed.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Originally Posted by Waltercito

Absolutly not, I love it.


You know, I'm also a horse racing enthusiast, and while in most "serious" countries a racehorse can have only one single name, which on top of that has to follow certain rules, this is not so in Paraguay, where I originally come from. In my spare time, I do research for the paraguayan Stud Book, and because in past times, many horses entered Paraguay illegally from Argentina or Brasil, their new paraguayan owners obviously changed their names for a fake one...and oh boy, I spent days searching in newspapers, writing e-mails to farms and foreign stud books, even comparing old pictures or videos to identify certain horses...you have to really love this stuff to do it.


So keep going, these oldtimers need their records completed.

Great story! Thank you for sharing. Yes, I've found myself just loving researching these old boxers and trying to fill in the pieces for them for them as accurately as possible present on BoxRec, not that they who all is involved is already doing a Great job with the database!

Rocco

[zyberianwarrior]

Het Rocco what do you have for Jack Sharkey? My game lists him as a 3 and looking at box rec he should be much much higher. a few tidbits from Box Rec World Heavyweight Title
As a result of the controversial decision of this bout, the NYSAC barred any but "boxing experts" (sports writers, referees, judges) from broadcasting descriptions of future matches. Sharkey vs Schmeling Sharkey lost via dq a few bouts prior. Against Young Stribling he won on points and the notes was interesting A heavyweight title elimination bout, arranged by Tex Rickard before his death the month before. Held under the auspices of the American Legion, as required by Florida law. A battle royale of 12 black fighters opened the card and Sharkey took the count of ten after going down from a vicious left hook to the jaw. The Boston sailor had claimed a foul blow to the mid-section just before the climax, but the referee, Jack O?Sullivan, refused to allow it and counted him out. Dempsey?s knockout victory, which sent the crowd into a delirious outburst, followed a slashing, slugging battle from start to finish. The former champion, staggered in the first round and groggy, came back to force the fighting and finally dropped his young rival." (Associated Press)
This was a heavyweight tournament elimination bout, with the winner to meet current World Champion Gene Tunney for a shot at his title.

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Here is the file I have rating done by the TBCB3 DB Team way back when.

I found some info on Find a Grave website confirmed a DOB and DOD. Just updated some minor things.

Nice little write up also. Interesting!
Rocco

[Rocco Del Sesto]

So, I've started a TB25 rating for one Walter Wazal/Wazel. Named it Wazal as I kind of gut feel is what is name is. I've found some information that points in that direction but what I've found for whatever reason the local papers were using both spellings. So before I dig deeper into the professional fights, I'm search for articles in 1934 thru 36 which cover his amateur days while in high school. I found a articles though later in 1942-45 that helps to tie to a short article found in 1926 about a young Walter Wazel and where he lived and how old. Here is what I've found that seem to point to Wazal. But, then also here are the amateur day articles for 1934 and you see that they start out in the year using Wazel spelling then temporarily you get the Wazal spelling but then a last Wazel use in and October article. Crazy.....

The Fitchburg Sentinel newspaper followed as far back as Nov 25, 1930 Walter Wazel as he was named in many of the papers (others did use Wazal), was playing High School Football in Fitchburg. That article happened to note that Walter Wazel was a Sophomore that year. That could put his age at possibly around 15? Estimate a date of birth around 1915.

Fri, Jul 02, 1926 Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - Quoting from the paper, "Walter Wazal, 383 Summer Street, Aged 11 years while fishing at Baker's pond yesterday, landed a hornpout measuring 12 1/2 inches and weighing 14 ounces." Based on the street address he's from that matched the family street address in a Dec 1942 article mentioned later in this bio for Walter Wazal, this is our boxer Walter Wazal. This article would place is DOB year also as 1915.

Here is the 1941-45 articles and a 1997 Obit for his brother Joseph maybe help tie things together to the Wazal spelling?

Fri, Feb 07, 1941, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - short article notes Walter Wazel if working as a boxing instructor at the "Y" gymnasium. Some later articles into early 1942 also mention him working instructing boxing.

Thu, Sept 24, 1942 Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - in the Sportfolio column, they comment that Walter "Slug" Wazel, along with a number of other Fitchburg athletes enlisted in the navy, had completed his recruit training and whould be assigned to active duty soon. It mentions Wazel being a former New England Gold Glove boxing champ. It says also Wazel had contributed his services to the Y.M.C.A. as a boxing instructor.

Mon, Dec 7, 1942, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - Walter Wazal, 383 Summer Street is listed along with many others currently in the military services. This the same Wazel talked about in the Sept 24 issue?

Tue, Dec 18th, 1942, Fitchburg Sentinel, Mass - Short piece talks about Joseph Wazal, coming home from 3 years of service in the US Army rejoining his family at 383 Summer Street. Says he has two brothers, Walter and George who were recently discharged form the navy.

Tue, Jan 14, 1997, Ventura County Star, Calif - Obituary for a Joseph A. Wazal, Age 80 of Port Hueneme, Died Jan 11, 1997. He was born July 7, 1916 in Fitchburg, Mass. Obituary says he is survived by a daughter, grandkids, sister and a brother, Walter Wazal of Oaklahoma. Appears to be the Joseph and Walter Wazal mentioned being in the services in WW2 from Fitchburg.

Interesting that in these late 1941 and 1942 Fitchburg Sentinels, another Walter Wazel playing high school football is mentioned in football articles. A common name in that neck of the woods? Has to be two different Walter Wazel or the boxer, Walter is spelled Wazal as in BoxRec. Just have not found anything to confirm that or not.

Tue, Oct 30, 1945 Fitchburg Sentinel article on various military personnel being discharged, a Walter T. Wazel "who as recently discharged from the navy after three years service is at home with his wife at 133 Lancaster Street Leominster. Mr. and Mrs. Wazel were formerly of Fitchburg."

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Started looking into 1935.....

Stream lining these posts removing all the bio info I end up putting in the fighters file. shorten the length of his thread that I felt was getting TO LONG for anyone to delve through!

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Nothing yet really I can see telling me Wazal and Wazel are not the same boxer. BTW...I'm writing these into the Bio notes for Walter Wazal rating I'm creating so you'll have a pretty thorough record of his amateur and professiSat, Feb 02, 1935, The Boston Globe, Mass - Friday evening amateur boxing show was staged in Revere, Mass at the Garfield A.A. in Walkathon Arena. Walter Wazal, Fitchburg knocked out Mello Calagresee, Boston in the second round final of the 160 pound class.

Stream lining these posts removing all the bio info I end up putting in the fighters file. shorten the length of his thread that I felt was getting TO LONG for anyone to delve through!

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Stream lining these posts removing all the bio info I end up putting in the fighters file. shorten the length of his thread that I felt was getting TO LONG for anyone to delve through!

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Found nothing in June, July and August 1935!

Stream lining these posts removing all the bio info I end up putting in the fighters file. shorten the length of his thread that I felt was getting TO LONG for anyone to delve through!

[Rocco Del Sesto]

Finishing out 1935 Wazal/Wazel amateur bouts...

Stream lining these posts removing all the bio info I end up putting in the fighters file. shorten the length of his thread that I felt was getting TO LONG for anyone to delve through!

[Waltercito]

Just wanted to say that I found a Walter Wazal Jr. (1945-2018) on Find a Grave. He was from San Diego, CA, though. I did NOT find any match for the name "Wazel".


So I tend to think Wazal is the correct spelling.