Defensive stats display problems

genghisdunn · 07-13-2006, 01:12 AM

I don't know if this ever made it over here, but I brought it up a few times in the other forum:

As they stand now, the defensive stats are largely useless in the game. Take a look for example at this guy:

http://rlpa.org/rlpa2006/news/html/p...ayer_1289.html

He's played 1st, 2nd, and 3rd base in his career, but I have no idea looking at that mishmosh of stats how well he does any of it in the long run. Could we get some totals at the bottom of the stats breaking it down by position (and, preferably, by position and by league both, so the major league stats would be separate from the AAA, AA, A, rookie, etc. stats)?

Look at this Cato page:

http://rlpa.org/cato/players/f/figginchone784.html

See how easily you can see both: (1) each year, how many games at each position Figgins played; and (2) for his career, how many games at each position he played. The current OOTP design - with alternating grey/white lines - is terrible (not just for defensive stats, but for pitching and offensive stats as well - group all things happening in one season together, and switch from grey to white as you go from year to year), and the lack of career totals just makes it worse.

Also, while we're at it, take a look at this team history page:

http://rlpa.org/rlpa2006/news/html/h...ar_5_2014.html

Team fielding stats doesn't even tell us what position each guy played. Adrian Gonzalez logged 1452 innings as a what? 1B? 2B? Some comination of positions? Who knows.

And you've got the footer there:

Last 2 columns are Fielding Percentage and Range Factor (expect Catcher where last column is Runners Thrown Out Percentage)
Numbers in headings are league average values.

that was obviously was copied directly from Catobase but never got implemented. The last two columns may be FP and Range factor, but I don't see anything about catchers' RTO. Nor do I see headings, or league average values. I believe what was intended by this little footnote was something like this:

http://rlpa.org/cato/teams/hou/2010.html

Again, look how useful that is compared to what OOTP shows you. For the team, you see everyone who played a position in a given year. You can easily compare them all to each other and to the league average (which actually is a number in the heading).

The way these defensive stats are set out in OOTP is just really, really awful right now. I know this kind of thing needed to go lower in importance than all of the crashes and memory leaks and unusable online mode stuff, but now that some of that has been cleared up I think this should be a pretty high priority.

genghisdunn · 07-14-2006, 01:13 AM

Bump.

genghisdunn · 07-15-2006, 12:51 AM

Bump.

I can keep this up forever.

tysok · 07-15-2006, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genghisdunn

Bump.

I can keep this up forever.

I don't doubt your talent.

Most likely this will move to suggestions and hopefully be put in in the next release.
However I agree with you that it should be done. It doesn't do a lot of good when you have to go wading through so many lines to find an incomplete picture of his defensive performance.

There are some other statistic things that need to be done as well... but they're not as needed as this one, probably because the others do at least provide a career total.

genghisdunn · 07-15-2006, 03:59 PM

Thank you for your support.

I don't really think this is a suggestion. For one thing, that footnote in the team history pages is just wrong - none of that is here, and so long as the note is there then the game has a glaring error in it. Either take it out or fix the display so that it's not wrong. This whole forum is about fixing errors. Well, here's an error. Fix it (or at least tell me that it's been logged and will be fixed down the road).

For another, it shouldn't be a "suggestion" that maybe we don't want to wait a year for usable defensive stats. As they are right now, they're not usable. It's a major flaw in the game, and it seems a whole lot more important than all these worries about the frequency with which the game is using some names when you use different countries of origin, or whether people can get their color choices refined just so. The heart of the attraction of OOTP has always been its rich statistical interface. 1/3 of that is currently crap. Seems like more than a suggestion.

I'd be thrilled with an entire universe of players named Nambrillo McWhaWha and Toots Baconfat if it meant the programmers had spent that time ensuring that the defensive stats were displayed properly.

genghisdunn · 07-16-2006, 04:08 PM

Bump.

genghisdunn · 07-19-2006, 08:47 PM

I can't decide if bumping is a good idea or a bad idea. If they're clearing the backlog from the earliest date, then this is silly.

So this is the last bump for now. But it's bookmarked. I'll be back. I want an answer. I've brought this up half a dozen times in a couple of different forums, and I can't even get anyone to acknowledge that it's a problem.

There are plenty of things I don't like about 2006 (and more things that I do like), but this is the worst one to me. If it doesn't get fixed, I'll never use the game, and we'll never convert our online league. That's how important defensive stats are to some people.

Anyway... bump.

battists · 07-24-2006, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genghisdunn

I can't decide if bumping is a good idea or a bad idea. If they're clearing the backlog from the earliest date, then this is silly.

Yup, I was going from earliest. It was silly.

But, it was such a great idea that I had already logged it a while ago as a recommended change.

So, it's definitely in our system to be looked at as an enhancement for next version. I doubt it will make it into a patch, though.

For now, closing out this issue.

Thanks very much!

Steve

07-13-2006, 01:12 AM	#1
genghisdunn Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 119	Defensive stats display problems I don't know if this ever made it over here, but I brought it up a few times in the other forum: As they stand now, the defensive stats are largely useless in the game. Take a look for example at this guy: http://rlpa.org/rlpa2006/news/html/p...ayer_1289.html He's played 1st, 2nd, and 3rd base in his career, but I have no idea looking at that mishmosh of stats how well he does any of it in the long run. Could we get some totals at the bottom of the stats breaking it down by position (and, preferably, by position and by league both, so the major league stats would be separate from the AAA, AA, A, rookie, etc. stats)? Look at this Cato page: http://rlpa.org/cato/players/f/figginchone784.html See how easily you can see both: (1) each year, how many games at each position Figgins played; and (2) for his career, how many games at each position he played. The current OOTP design - with alternating grey/white lines - is terrible (not just for defensive stats, but for pitching and offensive stats as well - group all things happening in one season together, and switch from grey to white as you go from year to year), and the lack of career totals just makes it worse. Also, while we're at it, take a look at this team history page: http://rlpa.org/rlpa2006/news/html/h...ar_5_2014.html Team fielding stats doesn't even tell us what position each guy played. Adrian Gonzalez logged 1452 innings as a what? 1B? 2B? Some comination of positions? Who knows. And you've got the footer there: Last 2 columns are Fielding Percentage and Range Factor (expect Catcher where last column is Runners Thrown Out Percentage) Numbers in headings are league average values. that was obviously was copied directly from Catobase but never got implemented. The last two columns may be FP and Range factor, but I don't see anything about catchers' RTO. Nor do I see headings, or league average values. I believe what was intended by this little footnote was something like this: http://rlpa.org/cato/teams/hou/2010.html Again, look how useful that is compared to what OOTP shows you. For the team, you see everyone who played a position in a given year. You can easily compare them all to each other and to the league average (which actually is a number in the heading). The way these defensive stats are set out in OOTP is just really, really awful right now. I know this kind of thing needed to go lower in importance than all of the crashes and memory leaks and unusable online mode stuff, but now that some of that has been cleared up I think this should be a pretty high priority. __________________ Proud owner of the 5-time RLPA World Champion Houston Astros.

07-14-2006, 01:13 AM	#2
genghisdunn Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 119	Bump. __________________ Proud owner of the 5-time RLPA World Champion Houston Astros.

07-15-2006, 12:51 AM	#3
genghisdunn Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 119	Bump. I can keep this up forever. __________________ Proud owner of the 5-time RLPA World Champion Houston Astros.

07-15-2006, 03:59 PM	#5
genghisdunn Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 119	Thank you for your support. I don't really think this is a suggestion. For one thing, that footnote in the team history pages is just wrong - none of that is here, and so long as the note is there then the game has a glaring error in it. Either take it out or fix the display so that it's not wrong. This whole forum is about fixing errors. Well, here's an error. Fix it (or at least tell me that it's been logged and will be fixed down the road). For another, it shouldn't be a "suggestion" that maybe we don't want to wait a year for usable defensive stats. As they are right now, they're not usable. It's a major flaw in the game, and it seems a whole lot more important than all these worries about the frequency with which the game is using some names when you use different countries of origin, or whether people can get their color choices refined just so. The heart of the attraction of OOTP has always been its rich statistical interface. 1/3 of that is currently crap. Seems like more than a suggestion. I'd be thrilled with an entire universe of players named Nambrillo McWhaWha and Toots Baconfat if it meant the programmers had spent that time ensuring that the defensive stats were displayed properly. __________________ Proud owner of the 5-time RLPA World Champion Houston Astros.

07-16-2006, 04:08 PM	#6
genghisdunn Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 119	Bump. __________________ Proud owner of the 5-time RLPA World Champion Houston Astros.

07-19-2006, 08:47 PM	#7
genghisdunn Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 119	I can't decide if bumping is a good idea or a bad idea. If they're clearing the backlog from the earliest date, then this is silly. So this is the last bump for now. But it's bookmarked. I'll be back. I want an answer. I've brought this up half a dozen times in a couple of different forums, and I can't even get anyone to acknowledge that it's a problem. There are plenty of things I don't like about 2006 (and more things that I do like), but this is the worst one to me. If it doesn't get fixed, I'll never use the game, and we'll never convert our online league. That's how important defensive stats are to some people. Anyway... bump. __________________ Proud owner of the 5-time RLPA World Champion Houston Astros.