3 or more team trades

r0nster · 05-19-2013, 10:38 AM

Am wondering is there a way to do a 3 or more team trades ???

Once in a while you might hear of 3 teams completing a single trade.

Also wonders how to offer more than one player on the shop player feature.

Cryomaniac · 05-19-2013, 10:46 AM

3 team trades would be really difficult to program good AI for. There's enough complaints about trade AI as it is (admittedly less in OOTP 13 & 14 than previously).

r0nster · 05-19-2013, 11:02 AM

I was just curious no biggie .... I was trying to do a trade and I saw a perfect chance to workout a 3 team trade which is what prompted me to ask.
I am fine just the way it is

just was worth asking

Cryomaniac · 05-19-2013, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r0nster

I was just curious no biggie .... I was trying to do a trade and I saw a perfect chance to workout a 3 team trade which is what prompted me to ask.
I am fine just the way it is

just was worth asking

Cheating slightly, but you could force it by using the commish mode.

r0nster · 05-19-2013, 04:45 PM

yes by doing the commish mode would indeed work .... I tried it and yes it works perfectly

Don't know why I never thought of that LOL

Questdog · 05-19-2013, 06:00 PM

In real life, their is technically no such thing as a three-way trade....

r0nster · 05-19-2013, 06:10 PM

when team A sends a player to Team B then team B sends another player to team C and to end the trade team C sends a player to team A

that's the 3 way trade as I understand it. unless perhaps I am missing something. I do know that officially the player has to be a member of the middle team (team B) of the trade even if for a moment then the trade is completed when the player gets to the team C.

I will just use that commish mode to do this.

JohnHoward · 05-20-2013, 12:32 PM

If you are the wheel team in a three team trade, you can do it, because I do it quite a bit. I see a player that Team A has listed on the trading block and I know he meets a need on Team C. I (Team B) trade for him, then flip him to Team C (or shop him around, either way). I get a lot of minor league depth this way and move players around who can still play. I don't have to go into commissioner mode to do any of this.

BIG17EASY · 05-20-2013, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Questdog

In real life, their is technically no such thing as a three-way trade....

Sure there is. The Yankees-Diamondbacks-Tigers trade in December of 2009 is the perfect example. Here's the transaction, straight from Austin Jackson's profile on Baseball-Reference:

"Traded as part of a 3-team trade by the New York Yankees with Phil Coke to the Detroit Tigers. The Detroit Tigers sent Curtis Granderson to the New York Yankees. The Detroit Tigers sent Edwin Jackson to the Arizona Diamondbacks. The New York Yankees sent Ian Kennedy to the Arizona Diamondbacks. The Arizona Diamondbacks sent Max Scherzer and Daniel Schlereth to the Detroit Tigers."

There's no "wheel" team and it was a long, complicated three-way negotiation for more than a week. The Yankees sent Ian Kennedy to Arizona, but did not get any players from the Diamondbacks, so it can't be called a combination of three smaller trades.

EDIT: The Michael Morse trade this year is an even better example. He went from the Nats to the Mariners, John Jaso went from the Mariners to the A's, and A.J. Cole and another prospect went from the A's to the Nats. No direct swaps at all in that one.

Cryomaniac · 05-20-2013, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIG17EASY

Sure there is. The Yankees-Diamondbacks-Tigers trade in December of 2009 is the perfect example. Here's the transaction, straight from Austin Jackson's profile on Baseball-Reference:

"Traded as part of a 3-team trade by the New York Yankees with Phil Coke to the Detroit Tigers. The Detroit Tigers sent Curtis Granderson to the New York Yankees. The Detroit Tigers sent Edwin Jackson to the Arizona Diamondbacks. The New York Yankees sent Ian Kennedy to the Arizona Diamondbacks. The Arizona Diamondbacks sent Max Scherzer and Daniel Schlereth to the Detroit Tigers."

There's no "wheel" team and it was a long, complicated three-way negotiation for more than a week. The Yankees sent Ian Kennedy to Arizona, but did not get any players from the Diamondbacks, so it can't be called a combination of three smaller trades.

EDIT: The Michael Morse trade this year is an even better example. He went from the Nats to the Mariners, John Jaso went from the Mariners to the A's, and A.J. Cole and another prospect went from the A's to the Nats. No direct swaps at all in that one.

You could still do that using commissioner mode. It wouldn't show up properly in the players' histories, but you could do it.

Questdog · 05-20-2013, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIG17EASY

Sure there is. The Yankees-Diamondbacks-Tigers trade in December of 2009 is the perfect example. Here's the transaction, straight from Austin Jackson's profile on Baseball-Reference:

"Traded as part of a 3-team trade by the New York Yankees with Phil Coke to the Detroit Tigers. The Detroit Tigers sent Curtis Granderson to the New York Yankees. The Detroit Tigers sent Edwin Jackson to the Arizona Diamondbacks. The New York Yankees sent Ian Kennedy to the Arizona Diamondbacks. The Arizona Diamondbacks sent Max Scherzer and Daniel Schlereth to the Detroit Tigers."

There's no "wheel" team and it was a long, complicated three-way negotiation for more than a week. The Yankees sent Ian Kennedy to Arizona, but did not get any players from the Diamondbacks, so it can't be called a combination of three smaller trades.

EDIT: The Michael Morse trade this year is an even better example. He went from the Nats to the Mariners, John Jaso went from the Mariners to the A's, and A.J. Cole and another prospect went from the A's to the Nats. No direct swaps at all in that one.

I did not say there are NOT 3-way trades......but that technically there is no mechanism for them in baseballs rules....all 3-way trades have to be executed as separate transactions.....

Cryomaniac · 05-20-2013, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Questdog

I did not say there are NOT 3-way trades......but that technically there is no mechanism for them in baseballs rules....all 3-way trades have to be executed as separate transactions.....

I'm guessing there is no mechanism for them because such a mechanism would be ludicrously complex, which implies it would also be ludicrously complex to write AI for.

BIG17EASY · 05-20-2013, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Questdog

I did not say there are NOT 3-way trades......but that technically there is no mechanism for them in baseballs rules....all 3-way trades have to be executed as separate transactions.....

I'd like to see where you found that info. Regardless of how the league files the paperwork, three-way trades absolutely do take place.

Cryomaniac · 05-20-2013, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIG17EASY

I'd like to see where you found that info. Regardless of how the league files the paperwork, three-way trades absolutely do take place.

What he's saying is that a "three team trade" is actually a series of 2 team trades, from the point of view of the rules.

BIG17EASY · 05-20-2013, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

What he's saying is that a "three team trade" is actually a series of 2 team trades, from the point of view of the rules.

I understand what he's saying. My point is that not every three-team trade has each team directly exchanging players with each other, so that theory doesn't always work. Although that could be proof that MLB looks at it that way. We've all seen how MLB is handling its umpires lately.

Matt Arnold · 05-21-2013, 03:43 PM

It would be nice to have a PTBNL type option in deals, but obviously understandably that would be very complicated to code.

Cryomaniac · 05-21-2013, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UWHabs

It would be nice to have a PTBNL type option in deals, but obviously understandably that would be very complicated to code.

It would also probably be quite easy to fleece the AI with that sort of deal.

Cras · 05-21-2013, 06:07 PM

Questdog is right, there is no such thing as three team trades. If you actually look at a transaction log from MLB, and not someone reporting on MLB, you would see a series of two team trades that results in what is reported as a three way deal. I remember doing this a few years back when the White Sox pulled one off and that....whoever it was....Orlando Hernandez maybe? before he joined as FA.....was a member of the Sox for like, 30 minutes.

r0nster · 05-21-2013, 06:10 PM

I tend to agree ... it is a series of agreed two team trades.

and 3 or more team trades is more a nickname for this kind of transaction that is agreed with 3 or more teams

BIG17EASY · 05-22-2013, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cras

Questdog is right, there is no such thing as three team trades. If you actually look at a transaction log from MLB, and not someone reporting on MLB, you would see a series of two team trades that results in what is reported as a three way deal. I remember doing this a few years back when the White Sox pulled one off and that....whoever it was....Orlando Hernandez maybe? before he joined as FA.....was a member of the Sox for like, 30 minutes.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but can you please provide a link that shows what you guys are saying? Here's a link straight from MLB.com that lists the Michael Morse trade as a three-team trade (scroll down to Jan. 16).

Major League Baseball Transactions | MLB.com: Transactions

I used to think what you guys are saying was true, but how would this Michael Morse trade be listed as a series of two-team trades? No matter how you look at it, someone would either be giving up a player with no compensation, or getting a player or players without giving something up.

And if it did work, why wouldn't MLB's official website list it that way?

05-19-2013, 10:38 AM	#1
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,047	3 or more team trades Am wondering is there a way to do a 3 or more team trades ??? Once in a while you might hear of 3 teams completing a single trade. Also wonders how to offer more than one player on the shop player feature.

05-19-2013, 10:46 AM	#2
Cryomaniac Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2007 Location: Hucknall, Notts, UK Posts: 4,903	3 team trades would be really difficult to program good AI for. There's enough complaints about trade AI as it is (admittedly less in OOTP 13 & 14 than previously). __________________

05-21-2013, 06:07 PM	#18
Cras Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: LEO Posts: 3,789	Questdog is right, there is no such thing as three team trades. If you actually look at a transaction log from MLB, and not someone reporting on MLB, you would see a series of two team trades that results in what is reported as a three way deal. I remember doing this a few years back when the White Sox pulled one off and that....whoever it was....Orlando Hernandez maybe? before he joined as FA.....was a member of the Sox for like, 30 minutes. __________________ The Chicago White Sox 1906, 1917, 2005 World Series Champions 1900, 1901, 1906, 1917, 1919, 1959, 2005 American League Champions 2000, 2005, 2008 American League Central Division Champions 1983, 1993 American League West Division Champions OOTP \| Orbiter \| SSMS \| FSX \| LoL \| MLP:FIM!

05-19-2013, 11:02 AM	#3
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,047	I was just curious no biggie .... I was trying to do a trade and I saw a perfect chance to workout a 3 team trade which is what prompted me to ask. I am fine just the way it is just was worth asking

05-19-2013, 04:45 PM	#5
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,047	yes by doing the commish mode would indeed work .... I tried it and yes it works perfectly Don't know why I never thought of that LOL

05-19-2013, 06:00 PM	#6
Questdog Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: In a dark, damp cave where I'm training slugs to run the bases...... Posts: 16,142	In real life, their is technically no such thing as a three-way trade....

05-19-2013, 06:10 PM	#7
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,047	when team A sends a player to Team B then team B sends another player to team C and to end the trade team C sends a player to team A that's the 3 way trade as I understand it. unless perhaps I am missing something. I do know that officially the player has to be a member of the middle team (team B) of the trade even if for a moment then the trade is completed when the player gets to the team C. I will just use that commish mode to do this.

05-20-2013, 12:32 PM	#8
JohnHoward All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 624	If you are the wheel team in a three team trade, you can do it, because I do it quite a bit. I see a player that Team A has listed on the trading block and I know he meets a need on Team C. I (Team B) trade for him, then flip him to Team C (or shop him around, either way). I get a lot of minor league depth this way and move players around who can still play. I don't have to go into commissioner mode to do any of this.

05-21-2013, 03:43 PM	#16
Matt Arnold OOTP Developer Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Here and there Posts: 15,762	It would be nice to have a PTBNL type option in deals, but obviously understandably that would be very complicated to code.

05-21-2013, 06:10 PM	#19
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,047	I tend to agree ... it is a series of agreed two team trades. and 3 or more team trades is more a nickname for this kind of transaction that is agreed with 3 or more teams