Pinch Hitting (Or Rather Not)

Dodger1 · 08-17-2015, 11:09 PM

Suddenly I have noticed, since the last update, a failure of tha ai to pinch hit for pitchers late in ball games. For example, I was leadin by two runs in the 9th, and the ai let a reliever lead off. He was 0-3 this year, and 1-14 in his career. They had three available pinch hitters, and two remaining relievers. Not too realistic. I have the game settingt for pinch hit for pitchers at "very often".

And in another game, a reliever batted in the 9th down 3 runs, man on first, one out. Again, available pinch hitters and relievers. Never noticed this before, and it certainly reduces the realism for me. Any thoughts?

Lukas Berger · 08-18-2015, 12:12 AM

Hmm, seems weird and not right, but I don't think this was adjusted in the patch.

Maybe some fluke occurrences?

If others have seen this though, I'll log it as a bug. Maybe something was inadvertently changed.

chief915 · 08-18-2015, 10:04 AM

I noticed a similar situation recently. I am the GM, and rarely "watch" individual games. But my team made it to the World Series and I watched the entire game 6 and game 7 play by play. Game 6 and 7 were both in the NL park, so pitchers were batting.

Game 6 - We're leading by 2 runs in the top of the 8th when our pitchers spot is due up. The pitcher had pitched well, but his pitch count was about 120 at this point and we have 3 very good rested relievers in the pen. The pitcher bats.....then struggles through the bottom of the 8th giving up one run and was replaced with a reliever for the bottom of the 9th.

Game 7 - Our starting pitcher is getting beat up and we're down 5-0 by the 4th inning...... The pitchers spot comes up....and he stays in the game and bats......

Doc_Brown · 08-18-2015, 10:56 AM

I've noticed it a couple of times, not all the time, but a few. I chalked it up to my manager being an idiot.

Dodger1 · 08-18-2015, 11:03 AM

I don't see it all the time either. But too often for me to write it off as managerial stupidity. Seems to happen at least once every couple weeks of game play.

CONN CHRIS · 08-18-2015, 11:03 AM

It's never been perfect. In the last version (which I am still playing) I had an odd one last night. I was up on the home team by a single run heading into the bottom of the ninth. With 5 rested relievers in the pen, the opposing ai pinch hit for the number 7,8 & 1 hitters while allowing the pitcher to hit for himself (with a man on second and one out). The pitcher hacked away and grounded out - no bunt attempt. If you plan to pinch hit for your lead off hitter and don't plan to even try to move the runner over, why on earth send the pitcher up there at all? No, he was not a good hitting pitcher.

Dodger1 · 08-18-2015, 01:26 PM

I have no problem with a reliever batting in a blow out to save the bullpen. Or with one batting in the 6th or 7 th if you have to save your last pinch hitter. But a team trailing in the 9th should NEVER have a pitcher hitting unless they're out of phs, or the pitcher is an exceptional hitter (maybe 2-3 in all of baseball). NEVER! But I 'be seen it happen several times since the last update, in just one team's games. Really hurts the believability.

BIG17EASY · 08-18-2015, 01:29 PM

I have definitely noticed this. First noticed it about a week ago in an extra inning game when a reliever was allowed to hit in the bottom of an inning while trailing. My team still had its backup catcher and an outfielder with a day-to-day injury (22ish percent performance loss) available. I shrugged it off as maybe the AI being coded to not use backup catchers or players with day-to-day injuries until a certain inning.

But yesterday I had my closer lead off the bottom of the ninth, down by one with a fully healthy backup middle infielder, the backup catcher and backup first baseman all available.

BusterKing · 08-18-2015, 04:05 PM

Same problem here. I play one pitch mode, so frustrating to see the AI so dumb. They are losing by one and don't pinch hit for the pitchers in the last few innings, and lots of players on their bench. Please fix. Not enjoyable the way it is. Thanks.

Westheim · 08-18-2015, 04:11 PM

So I am not the only one having seen this more often recently than it used to be. Yes, the rate at which AI relievers have been sent to bat in non-blowout situations felt significantly increased.

Matt Arnold · 08-18-2015, 05:20 PM

Weird, because I don't see this in my testing. The only times I've seen relievers hit late in games is when there's nobody on the bench, or nobody else in the pen.

You can argue about bullpen or pinch hitter usage, but I can tell you that in our check whether to pinch hit, we have explicit checks for late game and trailing where we always pinch hit.

Dodger1 · 08-18-2015, 08:29 PM

I appreciate your response Matt, but I can tell you it is definitely not happening that way. It has only been noticeable to me since the last update. Have you rechecked since then? I rechecked my settings, and definitely have ph for pitchers set to "very often", but as noted above, it really doesn't happen as it should.

08-17-2015, 11:09 PM	#1
Dodger1 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 137	Pinch Hitting (Or Rather Not) Suddenly I have noticed, since the last update, a failure of tha ai to pinch hit for pitchers late in ball games. For example, I was leadin by two runs in the 9th, and the ai let a reliever lead off. He was 0-3 this year, and 1-14 in his career. They had three available pinch hitters, and two remaining relievers. Not too realistic. I have the game settingt for pinch hit for pitchers at "very often". And in another game, a reliever batted in the 9th down 3 runs, man on first, one out. Again, available pinch hitters and relievers. Never noticed this before, and it certainly reduces the realism for me. Any thoughts?

08-18-2015, 11:03 AM	#6
CONN CHRIS Global Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 29,001	It's never been perfect. In the last version (which I am still playing) I had an odd one last night. I was up on the home team by a single run heading into the bottom of the ninth. With 5 rested relievers in the pen, the opposing ai pinch hit for the number 7,8 & 1 hitters while allowing the pitcher to hit for himself (with a man on second and one out). The pitcher hacked away and grounded out - no bunt attempt. If you plan to pinch hit for your lead off hitter and don't plan to even try to move the runner over, why on earth send the pitcher up there at all? No, he was not a good hitting pitcher. __________________ Check Out My Cards!

08-18-2015, 01:26 PM	#7
Dodger1 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 137	Just to Clarify I have no problem with a reliever batting in a blow out to save the bullpen. Or with one batting in the 6th or 7 th if you have to save your last pinch hitter. But a team trailing in the 9th should NEVER have a pitcher hitting unless they're out of phs, or the pitcher is an exceptional hitter (maybe 2-3 in all of baseball). NEVER! But I 'be seen it happen several times since the last update, in just one team's games. Really hurts the believability.

08-18-2015, 04:11 PM	#10
Westheim Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Germany Posts: 13,630	So I am not the only one having seen this more often recently than it used to be. Yes, the rate at which AI relievers have been sent to bat in non-blowout situations felt significantly increased. __________________ Portland Raccoons, 92 years of excell-.... of baseball: Furballs here! 1983 * 1989 * 1991 * 1992 * 1993 * 1995 * 1996 * 2010 * 2017 * 2018 * 2019 * 2026 * 2028 * 2035 * 2037 * 2044 * 2045 * 2046 * 2047 * 2048 * 2051 * 2054 * 2055 * 2061 1 OSANAI : 2 POWELL : 7 NOMURA \| RAMOS : 8 REECE : 10 BROWN : 15 HALL : 27 FERNANDEZ : 28 CASAS : 31 CARMONA : 32 WEST : 39 TONER : 46 SAITO Resident Mets Cynic - The Mets from 1962 onwards, here.

08-18-2015, 12:12 AM	#2
Lukas Berger OOTP Developments Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Nice, Côte d'Azur, France Posts: 21,357	Hmm, seems weird and not right, but I don't think this was adjusted in the patch. Maybe some fluke occurrences? If others have seen this though, I'll log it as a bug. Maybe something was inadvertently changed.

08-18-2015, 10:04 AM	#3
chief915 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Kentucky Posts: 32	I noticed a similar situation recently. I am the GM, and rarely "watch" individual games. But my team made it to the World Series and I watched the entire game 6 and game 7 play by play. Game 6 and 7 were both in the NL park, so pitchers were batting. Game 6 - We're leading by 2 runs in the top of the 8th when our pitchers spot is due up. The pitcher had pitched well, but his pitch count was about 120 at this point and we have 3 very good rested relievers in the pen. The pitcher bats.....then struggles through the bottom of the 8th giving up one run and was replaced with a reliever for the bottom of the 9th. Game 7 - Our starting pitcher is getting beat up and we're down 5-0 by the 4th inning...... The pitchers spot comes up....and he stays in the game and bats......

08-18-2015, 10:56 AM	#4
Doc_Brown All Star Starter Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,326	I've noticed it a couple of times, not all the time, but a few. I chalked it up to my manager being an idiot.

08-18-2015, 01:29 PM	#8
BIG17EASY Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 3,291	I have definitely noticed this. First noticed it about a week ago in an extra inning game when a reliever was allowed to hit in the bottom of an inning while trailing. My team still had its backup catcher and an outfielder with a day-to-day injury (22ish percent performance loss) available. I shrugged it off as maybe the AI being coded to not use backup catchers or players with day-to-day injuries until a certain inning. But yesterday I had my closer lead off the bottom of the ninth, down by one with a fully healthy backup middle infielder, the backup catcher and backup first baseman all available.

08-18-2015, 04:05 PM	#9
BusterKing Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,421	Same problem here. I play one pitch mode, so frustrating to see the AI so dumb. They are losing by one and don't pinch hit for the pitchers in the last few innings, and lots of players on their bench. Please fix. Not enjoyable the way it is. Thanks.

08-18-2015, 05:20 PM	#11
Matt Arnold OOTP Developer Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Here and there Posts: 15,812	Weird, because I don't see this in my testing. The only times I've seen relievers hit late in games is when there's nobody on the bench, or nobody else in the pen. You can argue about bullpen or pinch hitter usage, but I can tell you that in our check whether to pinch hit, we have explicit checks for late game and trailing where we always pinch hit.

08-18-2015, 08:29 PM	#12
Dodger1 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 137	I appreciate your response Matt, but I can tell you it is definitely not happening that way. It has only been noticeable to me since the last update. Have you rechecked since then? I rechecked my settings, and definitely have ph for pitchers set to "very often", but as noted above, it really doesn't happen as it should.