Managing Minors Promotions Demotions

[sreem]

Would like some feedback and experiances from those of you who handle the promotion/demotion for your minor league teams.
The way I've always played is I promote players in only three situations: 1) when they have a GREEN arrow 2) If they have average or better stats and an injury opens a spot in the above league or 3) A player in the above league gets tagged with a RED arrow and I have a player with average or better stats to replace them in the lower league.
This may be confusing but suffice to say I have only experience moderate to what I would consider poor results from this system. Most of the guys I promote tend to get demoted or stall out and get release due to age. Most never see a day in the majors (I realize this is accurate), but most of my studs (top 3 draft picks) seem to flame out also.
I've noticed that many of my top picks (1-5 rounds) will spend 3 plus seasons in Rookie ball and never get a GREEN arrow (I review my teams weekly via the transactions page to see where the players are at).

So all that said, I would really like to get others experiances if you are willing to share! Thanks!

[GoPedro99]

I don't really look at the arrows. I go by stats. Even with ratings. I go by stats. If someone is hitting 340 with 10 hr I'm going to move them up no matter the situation

[mitchkenn]

while i DO use the arrows, mostly it's just as a hint for me to look seriously at his numbers. What i look at mostly is their actual stats in the minors to see if they are making progress and seem ready for advancement. i also use the "stars" in helping my decision. i admit i've traded away a few guys that turned into mega stars because their numbers didn't seem impressive to me, but by and large this system seems to work for me pretty well.

[cavebutter]

I'd be interested in hearing how others do this as well.

Personally, I don't pay much attention to injuries or putting together competitive rosters on my minor league teams. At the end of every month, I review my minor league report (the arrows) and dissect the stats. I do not put a lot of weight on the arrows, but they do prompt me to look more closely at certain players.

I make moves and cuts based on how players are performing at their level and how that performance measures against my plans for those players. I do keep a fair number of under-performing players at their current level if I know that they aren't destined for the bigs, just to keep roster spots warm. If an under-performer is blocking someone I do have plans for, I will move them down (or sometimes even up) to give my prospect some playing time.

I bring the hatchet twice a year: right before draft day is my biggest cut. I generally cut all players in R or SA who are 1) playing below average and 2) about to enter their 3rd year at that level. I make shallower cuts with the same criteria in A and AA.

At the end of the ML season, I make some more cuts, but usually just shuffle my roster, sending lots of guys up or down.

[sreem]

For those focusing just on stats, do you have concerns about studs just hitting a wall? I thought I saw in a post or maybe the manual that a great player can perform poorly in the minors if they aren't being challenged enough?

[JMDurron]

Originally Posted by sreem

For those focusing just on stats, do you have concerns about studs just hitting a wall? I thought I saw in a post or maybe the manual that a great player can perform poorly in the minors if they aren't being challenged enough?

My biggest issue with focusing on stats is for my prospect pitchers. For hitters, no problem. For pitchers, though, especially when I am training my position players to learn new positions, their stats can be extremely skewed by the defense behind them. So, I use ratings (with perfect scouting) guidelines based on what level I want a player to be at in order to be promoted to a certain league level.

[sreem]

How long do you guys stick with players in R Ball and SA Ball? Do you push guys up from these leagues to fill the holes in the upper minors? or do you sign free agents just to plug the holes?

[Mr. Marlin]

I play stats only so I never see their stars or ratings. I focus on progression only. I make no changes for the first two months (unless someone is just blowing the competition away) Then I'll compare 1st month to 2nd month in the key stats I focus on, AVG, OPS, & PA/SO for hitters & OBA, K/9, BB/9 & SS/SO for pitchers. If they are improving by a certain percentage they get promoted. I'll do that every month of the season.

[Mr. Marlin]

Originally Posted by sreem

How long do you guys stick with players in R Ball and SA Ball? Do you push guys up from these leagues to fill the holes in the upper minors? or do you sign free agents just to plug the holes?

For rookies it's either up or out. For me rookie leagues are for draftees or players who didn't finish their rookie season for injury. At the end almost everyone goes on to A where they get one season. Play well or go home. There is no demotion below A for me, only a bus ticket.

[sreem]

Originally Posted by Mr. Marlin

For rookies it's either up or out. For me rookie leagues are for draftees or players who didn't finish their rookie season for injury. At the end almost everyone goes on to A where they get one season. Play well or go home. There is no demotion below A for me, only a bus ticket.

How do you utilize SA then?

[sreem]

Originally Posted by Mr. Marlin

For rookies it's either up or out. For me rookie leagues are for draftees or players who didn't finish their rookie season for injury. At the end almost everyone goes on to A where they get one season. Play well or go home. There is no demotion below A for me, only a bus ticket.

Does this force you to release many A Ball players as well?

[BIG17EASY]

I use a combo of stats and looking at the ratings relative to the level they would be moving up to. For rookie level, I give guys a max of two years there. After that, if they aren't ready for short-season A, they get released to make room for draftees.

[Mr. Marlin]

Originally Posted by sreem

How do you utilize SA then?

I don't. Rookie level is my only half season level. I do have an SA level but it plays a full season just like the others. The reason I did this is the game does not understand the Class A and Class A advanced concept. A is A to OOTP. But it DOES understand SA is a step below A. So by making SA full season I created the A & advanced A.


The way I work it is the rookie league is my draft class. With very few exceptions all draftees spend their first season there. Most will get to go on to SA, if they really performed they go straight to A. I use roster limits so only 27 spots at each level above Rookie and 35 at rookie so obviously not everyone goes. If they were injured I'll give them another season at Rookie. The SA team get's it's roster turned over every season. No one spends more than one season in my full season SA. If they are a better option than the guy in A ball above them they get prompted. If they are not they get released.


I only use a fictional set up. This model does not conform to the MLB Quickstart or anything done in real life so take that for what it's worth. I use 5 levels of minors.

[cavebutter]

Originally Posted by Mr. Marlin

I don't. Rookie level is my only half season level. I do have an SA level but it plays a full season just like the others. The reason I did this is the game does not understand the Class A and Class A advanced concept. A is A to OOTP. But it DOES understand SA is a step below A. So by making SA full season I created the A & advanced A.

I like this idea! Implementing it next season. I wonder about the roster limits, though. I have had problems putting limits on low minors.

[sreem]

Originally Posted by Mr. Marlin

I don't. Rookie level is my only half season level. I do have an SA level but it plays a full season just like the others. The reason I did this is the game does not understand the Class A and Class A advanced concept. A is A to OOTP. But it DOES understand SA is a step below A. So by making SA full season I created the A & advanced A.


The way I work it is the rookie league is my draft class. With very few exceptions all draftees spend their first season there. Most will get to go on to SA, if they really performed they go straight to A. I use roster limits so only 27 spots at each level above Rookie and 35 at rookie so obviously not everyone goes. If they were injured I'll give them another season at Rookie. The SA team get's it's roster turned over every season. No one spends more than one season in my full season SA. If they are a better option than the guy in A ball above them they get prompted. If they are not they get released.


I only use a fictional set up. This model does not conform to the MLB Quickstart or anything done in real life so take that for what it's worth. I use 5 levels of minors.

Thanks for the info, but I believe the game does understand the concept of the different levels of A ball. For example, I've tried moving guys before from my team in the Midwest league (low A ball) to my team in the California League (High A Ball) and the player is given a RED arrow as soon as I move him, and vice versa (with GREEN arrow).

[Mr. Marlin]

Originally Posted by sreem

Thanks for the info, but I believe the game does understand the concept of the different levels of A ball. For example, I've tried moving guys before from my team in the Midwest league (low A ball) to my team in the California League (High A Ball) and the player is given a RED arrow as soon as I move him, and vice versa (with GREEN arrow).

If it does now then that's new. But I haven't played the MLB start in a VERY long time. I've been playing the same fictional game since OOTP14 through 15 & 16 and 80 some odd seasons now. I know in the fictional leagues it does not differentiate.

[curt]

I short list a lot of my triple AAA guys in spring training that have promise. Under the GM tab, I get a message of all my short listed guys doing well as the season progresses. Then I check them out. I also promote as required do to injuries, etc.

[jpeters1734]

Originally Posted by JMDurron

My biggest issue with focusing on stats is for my prospect pitchers. For hitters, no problem. For pitchers, though, especially when I am training my position players to learn new positions, their stats can be extremely skewed by the defense behind them. So, I use ratings (with perfect scouting) guidelines based on what level I want a player to be at in order to be promoted to a certain league level.

I try to focus on what a pitcher can control: keeping the ball in the park, walks, and strikeouts. If those improve or if they stay the same when playing in a higher level than the last year, he's ready to move up

Originally Posted by sreem

Thanks for the info, but I believe the game does understand the concept of the different levels of A ball. For example, I've tried moving guys before from my team in the Midwest league (low A ball) to my team in the California League (High A Ball) and the player is given a RED arrow as soon as I move him, and vice versa (with GREEN arrow).

This is because of the pcm settings. That is how the game recognizes advanced A and regular A. Pcm's closer to 1.000 will be recognized as the higher level. Doing this, you can have two A leagues playing fictional as well. I personally just use a full season SA because it's easier. I also use a full season rookie. I like to see my rookie league holdovers play until the draft. Then I have more games to evaluate and will cut the underperformers so the drafted players have room to play.

[Curve Ball Dave]

Originally Posted by sreem

How long do you guys stick with players in R Ball and SA Ball? Do you push guys up from these leagues to fill the holes in the upper minors? or do you sign free agents just to plug the holes?

I play with both Rookie and SA. A guy has to be really bad to not move from Rookie to SA so practically everyone makes it. I have two SA teams and those two feed to my low A team. If a player still isn't ready for full season A after two years at SA then it's have a nice a life in your new career, kid.

Once I get to my A teams and up I sign minor league free agents to plug any wholes and fill out the rosters if I don't have any kids to promote up from the short season squads. I'm extra patient with pitchers, particularly starters. They can suck for a while before I give up them. Beyond that, regardless of what level they are at once I conclude they will not help the MLB team in some capacity in the future I cut them loose. That can happen at any point in their minor league careers.

[DustinthePOWERHOUSE]

I play reluctantly with rookie (sometimes two) and SA but really short A does absolutely nothing.

I used to use the suggestions/arrows but I got tired of the slow promotion process. Plus I was looking for a bigger challenge so my scouting is lower.

I use WAR and of course the triple slash to determine whether or not someone is ready. Sure it causes a few people to come up prematurely or to be called up too early but most of the time it's fine. The ratings also factor in as well. Especially when a player has ratings that are above the league average or are at least closer to AAA/MLB.