Starting players moving position on their own (historical league)

Vexxer · 05-02-2018, 01:05 PM

I am playing a GM career in the '20's, and I am having issues with players changing position on their own. I can understand bench players learning a new position or something, but I just had my 3yr starter at second base jump to 1st base (without knowing the position at all previously), and completely forgetting how to play 2nd base, all in one off season. This was just the latest, it seems like every season at least one, sometimes two or three starters just change positions for no reason.

Since its a historical game, is this something hard coded in, for players to move position like they may have in real life? Its making it really hard to build a contender when I keep having starting players move to other positions to become bench players.

actionjackson · 05-02-2018, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexxer

I am playing a GM career in the '20's, and I am having issues with players changing position on their own. I can understand bench players learning a new position or something, but I just had my 3yr starter at second base jump to 1st base (without knowing the position at all previously), and completely forgetting how to play 2nd base, all in one off season. This was just the latest, it seems like every season at least one, sometimes two or three starters just change positions for no reason.

Since its a historical game, is this something hard coded in, for players to move position like they may have in real life? Its making it really hard to build a contender when I keep having starting players move to other positions to become bench players.

What player made this change? Did he make a similar change at a similar point in his career IRL? Do you play with recalc on or off? What do you have Game > Game Settings > League Settings > Historical > Historical Progressing Settings > Base player roles/positions on set to? AI evaluation, or Real Life Stats? There are many reasons for the possibility of this happening, but in order to help, I'd need to know what you have these set to.

Vexxer · 05-02-2018, 01:36 PM

It is set to AI evaluation.

actionjackson · 05-02-2018, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexxer

It is set to AI evaluation.

And the other settings/questions?

Vexxer · 05-02-2018, 01:51 PM

Sorry. Yes to both. Atleast in the last case, the player did play both positions IRL, and recalc is turned on for every 3 years. I think I am starting to answer my own question.

actionjackson · 05-02-2018, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexxer

Sorry. Yes to both. Atleast in the last case, the player did play both positions IRL, and recalc is turned on for every 3 years. I think I am starting to answer my own question.

Which player?

Vexxer · 05-02-2018, 02:10 PM

Lew Fonseca

actionjackson · 05-02-2018, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexxer

Lew Fonseca

Yep. He moved from 2B to 1B in 1928 at age 29. Watch out, he could be becoming a corner OF in about three years.

Anticipating your next question, I'm not sure how you can make this not happen. I'm trying "Base Fielding Ratings and Pitcher Stamina" on Entire Career this time around for the Historical Player Ratings, which may take care of these things along with the setting for "Base Player Roles/Positions on..." at AI Evaluation. I'll see how it goes. I can empathize because I know how annoying it can be to get your team set up, and then all of a sudden...things change.

Orcin · 05-02-2018, 03:15 PM

The “entire career” setting might be better, but it can sometimes prevent you from having a player at a certain position that you need. For example, Biggio might not have rating at CF.

Spritze · 05-02-2018, 04:17 PM

There is an unfixed bug in 19 that can and does turn any player into a first baseman mid-career, even pitchers. I often have reserve rosters made up nearly entirely of such players. With minors on many teams play these guys there even if they struggle to hit .150 with 0 extra base hits.

actionjackson · 05-02-2018, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orcin

The “entire career” setting might be better, but it can sometimes prevent you from having a player at a certain position that you need. For example, Biggio might not have rating at CF.

I just happen to have a 24-year old Craig Biggio in the inaugural draft of my historical random debut, and he is rated (very well) at C, 2B, and CF. I don't know if he will stay this way, but he looks OK to me.

actionjackson · 05-02-2018, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spritze

There is an unfixed bug in 19 that can and does turn any player into a first baseman mid-career, even pitchers. I often have reserve rosters made up nearly entirely of such players. With minors on many teams play these guys there even if they struggle to hit .150 with 0 extra base hits.

Ugh. Is this with guys that have RL fielding stats? Probably is, but I had to ask.

Syd Thrift · 05-02-2018, 07:16 PM

I only do fictional, but there are a couple things to bear in mind overall and for this period of time:

- Sometimes a player will just fall below what the game considers to be the minimum requirements to play a position - a shortstop has to have a decent range and error rating, for example - and they'll become unrated as a result. I see this pretty often with older players, relatively speaking - they get into their 40s and they just aren't rated up the middle anymore. IRL very few players continue to play at those positions as they get older, and the ones that do were usually superstars with the glove in their prime (Omar Vizquel and Ozzie Smith come to mind as exceptions).

- In the deadball era to the 20s and into the 30s, you can actually hide a meh defender at second base even if he's not "rated" by the game. This is a dangerous game to play, potentially, but if he's still got a decent error rating he won't embarrass you in the field. He won't turn double plays but nobody turned double plays back then, and his range will suck, but range wasn't as big a deal for infielders in general during that time compared to now (error rating was a much bigger deal). I don't think you can do this so well with third base because if that arm's not there you're going to see a sub-900 FA regardless, but this actually reflects real life, where guys like Rogers Hornsby were kind of awful defenders who were hidden at 2nd whereas the few HOF 3B from this period - Pie Traynor, Home Run Baker, Jimmy Collins - were considered plus defenders (Traynor in particular was like Brooks Robinson before Brooks Robinson).

Spritze · 05-02-2018, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionjackson

Ugh. Is this with guys that have RL fielding stats? Probably is, but I had to ask.

Yes, that is why a bug is what it is. In historicals the game should not play everyone at 1b even if they took a year off IMO. Positions played during previous year at a minimum. The game converts everybody to 1b eventually.

clamel · 05-03-2018, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spritze

Yes, that is why a bug is what it is. In historicals the game should not play everyone at 1b even if they took a year off IMO. Positions played during previous year at a minimum. The game converts everybody to 1b eventually.

Horrible news. A minor league issue with major problems. I do hope the bug is reported and that it will be fixed.
It's hard enough to know certain player that changed drastically IRL and now know they might turn into 1B player if it's bad new defensive ratings. Guess that's why my prior issue with Herb Washington got him setup as 1B when he didn't have any defensive (or even offensive) ratings.

Recalc of 3-y are pretty standard to play, but always concern with pitchers changing from very good starters to closers. Eckersley and Smoltz are some I think on. You have either in a very good starting lineup and boom they turn closers the next year.
The AI will probably get even more fooled by this, having perhaps Eck and before the switch getting another world class closer. The deal to get that other closer probably would never been made if the AI could have looked into the future.

05-02-2018, 01:05 PM	#1
Vexxer Bat Boy Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 4	Starting players moving position on their own (historical league) I am playing a GM career in the '20's, and I am having issues with players changing position on their own. I can understand bench players learning a new position or something, but I just had my 3yr starter at second base jump to 1st base (without knowing the position at all previously), and completely forgetting how to play 2nd base, all in one off season. This was just the latest, it seems like every season at least one, sometimes two or three starters just change positions for no reason. Since its a historical game, is this something hard coded in, for players to move position like they may have in real life? Its making it really hard to build a contender when I keep having starting players move to other positions to become bench players.

05-02-2018, 02:10 PM	#7
Vexxer Bat Boy Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 4	Lew Fonseca Last edited by Vexxer; 05-02-2018 at 02:13 PM.

05-02-2018, 04:17 PM	#10
Spritze OOTP Historical Czar Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Bothell Wa Posts: 7,253	There is an unfixed bug in 19 that can and does turn any player into a first baseman mid-career, even pitchers. I often have reserve rosters made up nearly entirely of such players. With minors on many teams play these guys there even if they struggle to hit .150 with 0 extra base hits. __________________ It's madness, madness, I tell you! For the love of God, don't do it!

05-02-2018, 01:36 PM	#3
Vexxer Bat Boy Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 4	It is set to AI evaluation.

05-02-2018, 01:51 PM	#5
Vexxer Bat Boy Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 4	Sorry. Yes to both. Atleast in the last case, the player did play both positions IRL, and recalc is turned on for every 3 years. I think I am starting to answer my own question.

05-02-2018, 03:15 PM	#9
Orcin Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 9,850	The “entire career” setting might be better, but it can sometimes prevent you from having a player at a certain position that you need. For example, Biggio might not have rating at CF.