Arguing the Call? Pointless?

Joe Shlabotnick · 06-03-2003, 03:52 PM

As in real life, I've always assumed that arguing the umpire's call can never result in a reversal of his decision. Either you get ignored, or you get thrown out of the game, right?

In which case, why the heck is it in the game? For people who enjoy getting tossed out of games? Maybe I'll start kicking dirt on the computer and tossing bats at the on-field screen ....

Treches · 06-03-2003, 04:18 PM

Cosmetic. Like some other irrelevant things, this was implemented to please some lads that were pestering about it not so long ago. I suppose it wasn't much of a deal for Markus to add it and he proceeded. The feature is actually quite a pain.

Joe Shlabotnick · 06-03-2003, 04:45 PM

Yes, it is. One time, I accidentally clicked the wrong thing, and got kicked out of an important game!

sporr · 06-03-2003, 05:20 PM

Yeah, unless it could result in some kind of morale boost for the team, it really is pointless.

Biggie Fries · 06-04-2003, 11:56 AM

I generally agree with the comments here... Except wouldn't it be better if we really didn't know whether it had any effect? In which case, it would be more like so-called real life. Managers get themselves kicked out of games because that think that it will show their players that they are sticking up for them, and the players may play better as a result; and/or that the umpires may feel compelled to "even up" the close calls.
This is one of a class of issues that I love to see debated on the boards, but for which I don't want a categorical answer from Markus or any of the game's other authorities. If we know too much about the internal tickings of the game, we lose the challenge of ferreting out such matters empirically, and/or the bliss that comes from thinking that we can control things that in fact we cannot.

Joe Shlabotnick · 06-04-2003, 12:17 PM

What would be better ... is if JUST ONCE IN A WHILE, the umpires changed their call because you argued. Has anyone ever had that happen? Without that possibility, I think the "argue the call" option is just silly and beneath the glory of this game.

Drinky Crow · 06-05-2003, 03:33 PM

I wouldn't get too hung up on it. Umps changing their call in the real world is very, very, rare. Since it is a minor feature there to please a few vocal people it will probably get dropped someday. I just ignore it.

mtaystl03 · 06-08-2003, 01:02 PM

I always thought if you went out there and argued a call and got on the ump and maybe thrown out every once in a while it would give your players a sense of importance or that you care and they play a little better...guess not.
-MT

pallison14 · 06-08-2003, 01:17 PM

Others have suggested that it gives your team a higher percentage of the close calls that occur later in the game.

Don't know if it's true or not, but would seem to be a logical effect. About the only time I'll go out and argue a call is after I get or 4 opportunities to, and I'm not overly concerned over the outcome of the game (or the result has already pretty much decided).

-p

eriqjaffe · 06-09-2003, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pallison14
About the only time I'll go out and argue a call is after I get or 4 opportunities to, and I'm not overly concerned over the outcome of the game (or the result has already pretty much decided).

-p

Hehe...sometimes, if the game is going very poorly and I'm getting frustrated (and you can't quite a game in Manager Mode), I almost HOPE there are opportunities to argue calls just so I can get thrown out...

--Eriq.

Gastric ReFlux · 06-10-2003, 05:11 PM

I've done that. You get a game where your team is down 10 runs after the first 3 innings, you begin praying for a call to argue and get tossed.

Tib · 06-11-2003, 01:14 AM

Based on some of the comments here, I'd say arguing calls is realistic after all.

1. You don't REALLY know if it has any positive effect, just like in a real game. Even this thread is unclear.

2. You actually look to get thrown out of blowouts. Don't real managers do that? Earl? Lou?

3.Sometimes you click on the wrong button and get thrown out for arguing. Don't real managers sometimes utter the exact wrong thing at the wrong moment and find themselves tossed?

If we didn't know it did nothing, we would swear it did something.

In fact, the only thing I'd change is to have a text box appear after you get tossed so you can tell the umpire in your own words what he and his three blind girlfriends can do with that horsesh*t call.

06-03-2003, 03:52 PM	#1
Joe Shlabotnick Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Row 12, Seat 7 Posts: 291	Arguing the Call? Pointless? As in real life, I've always assumed that arguing the umpire's call can never result in a reversal of his decision. Either you get ignored, or you get thrown out of the game, right? In which case, why the heck is it in the game? For people who enjoy getting tossed out of games? Maybe I'll start kicking dirt on the computer and tossing bats at the on-field screen .... __________________ This space for rent.

06-03-2003, 04:18 PM	#2
Treches Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Damned Hell Posts: 2,150	Cosmetic. Like some other irrelevant things, this was implemented to please some lads that were pestering about it not so long ago. I suppose it wasn't much of a deal for Markus to add it and he proceeded. The feature is actually quite a pain. __________________ The Computer Baseball League

06-03-2003, 04:45 PM	#3
Joe Shlabotnick Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Row 12, Seat 7 Posts: 291	Yes, it is. One time, I accidentally clicked the wrong thing, and got kicked out of an important game! __________________ This space for rent.

06-04-2003, 11:56 AM	#5
Biggie Fries Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Bryn Mawr, PA USA Posts: 115	I generally agree with the comments here... Except wouldn't it be better if we really didn't know whether it had any effect? In which case, it would be more like so-called real life. Managers get themselves kicked out of games because that <i>think</i> that it will show their players that they are sticking up for them, and the players <i>may</i> play better as a result; and/or that the umpires may feel compelled to "even up" the close calls. <p>This is one of a class of issues that I love to see debated on the boards, but for which I don't want a categorical answer from Markus or any of the game's other authorities. If we know too much about the internal tickings of the game, we lose the challenge of ferreting out such matters empirically, and/or the bliss that comes from thinking that we can control things that in fact we cannot.

06-04-2003, 12:17 PM	#6
Joe Shlabotnick Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Row 12, Seat 7 Posts: 291	What would be better ... is if JUST ONCE IN A WHILE, the umpires changed their call because you argued. Has anyone ever had that happen? Without that possibility, I think the "argue the call" option is just silly and beneath the glory of this game. __________________ This space for rent.

06-03-2003, 05:20 PM	#4
sporr Global Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Muscatine, IA Posts: 8,277	Yeah, unless it could result in some kind of morale boost for the team, it really is pointless.

06-05-2003, 03:33 PM	#7
Drinky Crow Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Lost Angeles, CA Posts: 152	I wouldn't get too hung up on it. Umps changing their call in the real world is very, very, rare. Since it is a minor feature there to please a few vocal people it will probably get dropped someday. I just ignore it.

06-08-2003, 01:02 PM	#8
mtaystl03 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO - BASEBALL TOWN USA Posts: 29	I always thought if you went out there and argued a call and got on the ump and maybe thrown out every once in a while it would give your players a sense of importance or that you care and they play a little better...guess not. -MT

06-08-2003, 01:17 PM	#9
pallison14 Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 452	Others have suggested that it gives your team a higher percentage of the close calls that occur later in the game. Don't know if it's true or not, but would seem to be a logical effect. About the only time I'll go out and argue a call is after I get or 4 opportunities to, and I'm not overly concerned over the outcome of the game (or the result has already pretty much decided). -p __________________ Commissioner, NGBL - Putting the FUNK in defunct. New York (AL), UBL

06-10-2003, 05:11 PM	#11
Gastric ReFlux Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Member #3409 Posts: 8,350	I've done that. You get a game where your team is down 10 runs after the first 3 innings, you begin praying for a call to argue and get tossed.

06-11-2003, 01:14 AM	#12
Tib All Star Reserve Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Paso Robles, CA Posts: 995	Based on some of the comments here, I'd say arguing calls is realistic after all. 1. You don't REALLY know if it has any positive effect, just like in a real game. Even this thread is unclear. 2. You actually look to get thrown out of blowouts. Don't real managers do that? Earl? Lou? 3.Sometimes you click on the wrong button and get thrown out for arguing. Don't real managers sometimes utter the exact wrong thing at the wrong moment and find themselves tossed? If we didn't know it did nothing, we would swear it did something. In fact, the only thing I'd change is to have a text box appear after you get tossed so you can tell the umpire in your own words what he and his three blind girlfriends can do with that horsesh*t call. __________________ https://forums.ootpdevelopments.com/...ad.php?t=64219